Ep 364: Are Single Folks Punished Financially?
SARAH: Hey, what's up? Hello! Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aro-ace girl (I'm Sarah, that's me.)
KAYLA: And a bi demisexual girl (that's me, Kayla.)
SARAH: Talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else we just don't understand.
KAYLA: On today's episode, ‘Being Single Makes You Poor.’
BOTH: Sounds fake, but okay.
SARAH: Welcome back to the pod.
KAYLA: Anybody else libbing out in the club tonight?
SARAH: We're libbing out. We're always leftist-maxing, but fuck it, we're libmaxing.
KAYLA: We’re libmaxing.
SARAH: We're hope-maxing.
KAYLA: We're hope-pilled, we're lib-core.
SARAH: See the last time I felt hope, it was foolish of me to do so.
KAYLA: I know.
SARAH: And this time, I guard my heart of hope much more closely.
KAYLA: I know.
SARAH: We're talking about the US elections in case anyone is confused.
KAYLA: Yeah, they went really well.
SARAH: They actually went really well.
KAYLA: From our perspective, at least.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: I'm sure many people are quite upset.
SARAH: It was only a couple, it was very few.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But they did kind of all go really well.
KAYLA: They really did.
SARAH: Did you see that the Pennsylvania, I think, Attorney General, maybe Virginia, they were worried about how he was going to do because he had a texting scandal where…
KAYLA: I was talking to a friend… I had not heard about it until last night, a friend was telling me about it and I was like, “slay, I love that for him.”
SARAH: Yeah. So, these texts came out where he had wished death upon Republicans and it wasn't even like, “oh, I wouldn't care if they died.”
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: It was like, “I would like to shoot them with a gun.”
KAYLA: And you know what?
SARAH: But it was phrased in a way that made it clear that it wasn't an actual threat, it was just a hypothetical thing.
KAYLA: Yeah. A little joke, perhaps.
SARAH: A little joke, joke. And then the person they were talking to was like, “I don't think you should joke about that.”
KAYLA: And then that person must have been the one to leak the texts, right?
SARAH: Yeah. Yeah.
KAYLA: Yeah. What a bitch. Come on now. Snitch!
SARAH: And he did better than Kamala by five points.
KAYLA: Hey, times they are a-changin'.
SARAH: I mean, the only thing that that proves is that maybe he should be a little bit more careful about who he vents to, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah, I mean. To me, I'm like, “slay, maybe I'll want to vote for you even more.” He's just like me, but.
SARAH: Also, I've seen a lot of tweets about how Dick Cheney dying the day that Zohran Mamdani was elected the mayor of New York is going to be a Muslim holiday.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Did you know that Zohran's hot wife was born in 1997?
KAYLA: Oh my God, we could be his hot wife.
SARAH: That could be us.
KAYLA: We could have been his hot wife.
SARAH: We could be the first lady of New York City starting on January 1st.
KAYLA: I am only one Kevin Bacon away from him so that's exciting
SARAH: Wow
KAYLA: Because my future brother-in-law works for Channel 5 News, which is a YouTube news. Actually, just a clip from a video he worked on was just on Kimmel last night.
SARAH: Nice.
KAYLA: But he is an editor and runs their socials and he did a lot of their New York mayoral election coverage so he interviewed Mamdani and Cuomo and covered the, I don't know if you've heard of the ‘Cool Girls for Capitalism’
SARAH: Mm, remarkable
KAYLA: He was the one that… that was he. So, we're right there, we're so close. We could be his wife.
SARAH: We could be his wife. Also, I love when people are like… like post a picture of her and they're like, “this is his wife.” And it's like, “yeah, she looks really cool.”
KAYLA: Thank God.
SARAH: Like she's hot and she’s cool.
KAYLA: She looks really cool. She looks like she could stomp on me and I'd be like, “thank you.”
SARAH: They also, in my mind, kind of give like golden retriever, black cat energy.
KAYLA: I do see that.
SARAH: Anyway, that was the U.S. politics section, do we have any housekeeping that's not related to U.S. politics?
KAYLA: Not that I can think of.
SARAH: Great. Kayla, what are we talking about this week?
KAYLA: This week, we are talking about finances. Do either of us know anything about that? No.
SARAH: I know that if you tax the rich…
KAYLA: Right. Yes, exactly, everything is better.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: No, specifically we got an email from someone with a topic idea, this person asked to remain anonymous, so would you like to name them?
SARAH: Barbie
KAYLA: Barbie, love. Okay, so Barb emailed in.
SARAH: Barb!? You're shortening it to Barb?
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Barb is different than Barbie.
KAYLA: It is. But I've had Stranger Things on the mind recently.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: And if you recall our Barb did tragically die.
SARAH: There is a Barb. Spoilers
KAYLA: Spoilers. Literally like 10 years ago, the first season came out at this point. I was dating a different man, anyway.
SARAH: I just had to think really hard to remember who Barb was.
KAYLA: Exactly.
SARAH: That's how long.
KAYLA: Exactly. Okay, anyway, so Barbie emailed in, has been avid listener since sometime during the pandemic. Thank you for your dedication.
SARAH: Wow, you're so brave.
KAYLA: That is so brave. So, Barb is in…
SARAH: Barbie.
KAYLA: Sorry, Barbie, I don't see pronouns, so I'm just going to go neutral. Barbie is in their 40s, and I don't know how long that they have identified as aspec, but they…
SARAH: Probably sometime during the pandemic.
KAYLA: I would… Yeah, I guess when they found us, perhaps. But they identify as gray aro-ace. So basically, Barbie kind of talks about… and this is something that we've talked about in many episodes before, that they feel like they are being punished financially for being a near-constant single person, saying there's no deals for studios or one-bedroom apartments, you know, there's vacation packages, we've talked about in the past, if you've read our book like Spotify Duo, couples massages, like…
SARAH: Taxes
KAYLA: Taxes, yeah. So, things as little as discounts all the way up to married couples and people with kids to getting tax write-offs.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: And Barbie goes on to talk about that they have started regretting some of their financial choices from when they were younger, saying that to combat boredom or perhaps loneliness, they used to spend a lot on music and books partly because they were more interested in intellectual connections than a romantic or sexual. And they said, you know, they don't regret spending money on meals out, live shows, movies, travel and stuff, they just wish they had been better about a budget. And they go on to say that at this point, buying things is just more and more tempting, right?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Like it is just so easy to buy things now. So, their kind of idea for a topic is are aces punished financially in our society? Which I think we've covered in previous episodes.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Like the answer is like, yes. Not broadening it out from aces, just more broadly to like single people
SARAH: Single people
KAYLA: Or people who are not prioritizing your standard romantic relationships.
SARAH: Romantic escalator
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: Yes. So, are aces punished financially in our society? Yes. Kayla, what's your beef and your juice for this week?
KAYLA: LOL. No, what I found most interesting about this email and how I think it's different from how we've talked about this in the past is the addition of the boredom and loneliness to this equation.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Because, yeah, if you look at it on a level of taxes, deals, things like that, like, yes, absolutely, single people are being punished. Like the world, the government subsidizes people being in couples. Like that is what the government wants to happen.
SARAH: Like single mothers with kids, you’re fucked, dude.
KAYLA: A nightmare, yeah. But what is interesting to me as I was trying to think back to times in my life where I was single and or very lonely and trying to think about my spending habits and whether that is really…
SARAH: Whether it impacted your spending
KAYLA: An impact, yeah. Because to me, and I was thinking about this and I was like, there are some ways that couples or people that date, aspiring non-singles, I guess, spend more money.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Like right now, I'm in the midst of planning a wedding, bitch, I've never been poorer, it's crazy. And like dating costs money. Right?
SARAH: Money, mm-hmm
KAYLA: Like going out with people costs money.
[00:10:00]
SARAH: And back in the day, too, when it was like the man always pays for the dates, like that existed because men worked and women didn't.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And you could have… you could support a full family, a couple and children off of one man's salary.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But that is no longer the case.
KAYLA: Imagine, imagine.
SARAH: So, yeah, like the reasons why like people are like, “oh, well, men actually pay for it. So, men are punished more.” It's like, “no.”
KAYLA: Not at this point, I would say. I think it's just expensive… Everything is expensive now.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: And dates usually involve doing something.
SARAH: Yes.
KAYLA: Which is just going to cost money.
SARAH: Money.
KAYLA: So, in that way, it's like, okay, yeah, people who are dating are maybe spending more money. But then it's also like, well, if I'm not spending my time dating and that's not how I'm meeting people, then how else am I filling my time? And can I do that for free?
SARAH: Yes.
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: Right. What do I do with my time? Nothing.
KAYLA: That's not true.
SARAH: I mean, I feel like I'm really curious just to hear your take on this, just because like I have never been in a relationship like that. So, like I don't have anything to compare it to.
KAYLA: Yeah, I… for me, it's hard to tell because… I guess, I'll take the singleness out of it, because as we know, I have rarely been single since I started dating. The time in my life where I would say I was like the loneliest was post-college when I moved to Connecticut for like my first job out of college. I moved there knowing no people and I had like two work friends and that was like it. And so, at that point to be honest…
SARAH: Two work friends and a cat.
KAYLA: I had two work friends and a cat and calling my parents every night, and that was life.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: At that point, I would say I was saving a lot of money because I did not have friends and I was too mentally ill to go try to find any. I was just staying in my house. Like I was not traveling, I was not going out with friends to eat, I wasn't like going to a concert.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: And my hobbies during that time were like listening to true crime podcasts and coloring in my coloring book
SARAH: Making paper
KAYLA: Because I was also… no, that was pandemic times.
SARAH: Oh, I guess that was before the pandemic.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: For me pandemic and like post-grad, I kind of put in one bucket because I didn't finish school until August. I had three months at my parents’ house. I moved to L.A. and then pandemic. But you started working earlier in 2019 than I did.
KAYLA: Yes. So, for whatever reason… well, I was also like very concerned about money at the time because it was my first job out of college and it paid like shit. So, I just was like, “I'm not going to be spending any money.” So, in that respect, I feel like I was not spending a lot of money, but I could see how someone in the position I was in would be spending a fuckton of money on like hobbies or… like, I was deeply depressed at the time and I just happened to not be in a stage of life where I was like shopping to make myself feel better.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: But that does like… that is a thing.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: At this point in my life, I am lucky to live near a lot of friends and so that often makes things more expensive because I just have people around me that like to go out and do things whereas I am more likely to be like, I could just sit in my house all day and be happy. So that makes me… like, I have people that are like pushing me to go out more. So that makes me spend more money but then at the same time, I share rent and I live with someone that I like share finances with so that privileges me in that way, so.
SARAH: Right. And also on a very basic level, like you don't need two sets of plates.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: You don't need to… like just like household items, you don't need multiples of because you can combine your assets.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: My assets are all my own. Everything in this fuck-ass house is mine, all my shit.
KAYLA: I mean, I'm thinking of like… no, because I guess we've lived together for so long now.
SARAH: Yeah, you may have started out with like, you know, cheap… You both had cheap ass shit.
KAYLA: But to be honest, no, it's… we started out with mostly my stuff because I graduated a year before Dean did, so, I had some stuff. And I'm also the one that like buys most of our furniture because he just like lets me do whatever I want
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: So, if there were to be a divorce, I would insist on taking most of the furniture because I picked it out.
SARAH: I mean, that also that… even though I had roommates for the first several years of me living here, the first month and a half or so I lived here, my roommate hadn't moved yet.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, like I did… I also didn't have a kitchen table for like months and months.
KAYLA: I still don't have a kitchen table.
SARAH: But then when that first roommate moved out and my second roommate moved in, that first roommate moved back to Michigan.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And so even some of the stuff that was theirs…
KAYLA: They just left it
SARAH: They were just like, “you can have it.”
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And most of the furniture was mine anyway. And so, then when my other roommate moved in, she was moving from across the country. So, like it wasn't like… and it was her first like living away from her parents since graduating.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, she didn't have like furniture and shit.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, it was mostly my stuff. And then there were a couple of things that we bought together but when she moved out, she just left them here.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, anyway.
KAYLA: Anyway. Something that I'm kind of thinking about is… So, like I mentioned, right now I'm in a place where like I have… I obviously live with my partner, but I have friends that live in my neighborhood, and that's very nice.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Thinking about if that was not the case, and that has been the case, Dean and I lived somewhere at one point where we moved there knowing no one and we eventually made like, again, two single friends and then that was life. But if I… I'm not a very good example of this, because clearly, I just told the story of I moved somewhere by myself and made absolutely no effort to go out and make new friends.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: The privilege of having a partner and especially living with them is that I don't really get lonely because there is always someone in my house for better or for worse, there's always a man in my house.
SARAH: I was talking to my therapist about this just a couple of hours ago.
KAYLA: Wow
SARAH: Because I have a therapist now, everyone, clap and cheer
KAYLA: Adult!
SARAH: And she was like, you know, like, “do you feel like you see… like you're social enough?” And I was like, “well, I mean, I know I have friends.”
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: A lot of them don't live here. I do have friends who live here, but also it’s L.A. and here is relative.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And I was supposed to go to a party over the past weekend with my friend because I was like, I'm not going by myself because I don't know the people hosting it. Like, I obviously know the people hosting it, I'm friends with them, but like I don't know them well enough and I don't know the other people there well enough to feel comfortable going by myself.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And then the person I was supposed to go with just had like a really horrible mental health day.
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: And it was in Santa Monica. And it was also the day of the last Dodgers-Jays game.
KAYLA: Oh, yeah, no
SARAH: And she was like, “I don't think I can do it.” And I was like, “well, I'm fully not going without you.”
KAYLA: Yeah, fair.
SARAH: So, I ended up doing absolutely nothing over Halloween weekend because the other event I was invited to that I wasn't going to go to anyway ended up getting canceled because one of the hosts was sick. So, you know.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But I wasn't going to go to it anyway because it was too… It was a bar crawl in downtown L.A. on Halloween.
KAYLA: No, girl, no
SARAH: And does that sound like my scene to you?
KAYLA: I don't know whose scene that is. Like, I know don’t… that would kill me.
SARAH: But I was like… where was I… Where was this headed? Okay, what was your… what were you saying?
KAYLA: You were talking about your therapist and your social…
SARAH: I was, what were you saying before that?
KAYLA: Oh, I was talking about how living with someone…
SARAH: Oh, I got it
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: And I was saying, like, when I had a roommate, I was a lot more social because my roommate forced me to be because she had friends and they would just be at my house.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Like I would just come home from work and they would be at my house. And then I got to know them and then they became my friends. One thing about me, I think I've said this before, is my chief method of making friends is I make exactly one friend and then I mooch all of their friends off of them.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: The problem when you're an adult is that doesn't work as well because people don't have as defined like friend groups. So, like it worked great in high school, it worked great in college and then also because I don't have a partner, I don't have someone bringing in their own group of friends.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And so, like, I see people way less than I did when I had a roommate, and I don't just mean my roommate, I mean, like other people who would come to my house or like my roommate would be like, “oh, we're going to fucking Olive Garden.”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like I'm still friends with her, she still invites me places, but it's harder when you don't live together.
[00:20:00]
KAYLA: Yeah. Well, there's just less of that like spontaneous plan-making when you're not physically with the person.
SARAH: Right. And at the time, a lot of her good friends were people she worked with.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And so, like they would be physically together.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And also, several of them couldn't drive.
KAYLA: Always helps.
SARAH: So, she would drive them to our house and they would like hang out. Whereas like now, if, you know, she doesn't work at the same place as them and many of them don't even work at the same place that she used to work either. And so, like you're coming from all sorts of different places and like, you know, it's… I… the friend that I have that actually lives closest to me is the infamous Dalton King.
KAYLA: Love.
SARAH: He actually only lives five minutes away from me.
KAYLA: Oh, my God, slay
SARAH: But I've never been in his apartment because he lives in a weird…What are they called? ADL.
KAYLA: I don't know.
SARAH: It's like a house and then it's like a shed, but then they make… they add things to the shed to make it a place where a person can live.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: He lives in one of those places. He doesn't even have a real stove. And I said, “Dalton King, you've lived there for like six years now and you haven't had a real stove?”
KAYLA: That’s wild. What do you mean by real stove?
SARAH: I don't know, ask him.
KAYLA: Okay. All right.
SARAH: Most of our hanging out is us driving each other to the airport, so.
KAYLA: Love that. Love that.
SARAH: Like I'm just… if people invite me places, I will go. And like, I know it's good for me, but like people only invite me to so many places, especially because I only have so many friends in L.A.
KAYLA: Well, plus L.A. is just like the worst for hanging out with people.
SARAH: I know
KAYLA: Like, it just ruins that
SARAH: My like BTS friends, like my Internet friends who live in SoCal, one of them lives downtown and doesn't have a car.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: The rest of them live in Orange County.
KAYLA: Just a different state at that point.
SARAH: Orange County is like at least an hour and a half away.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: If the traffic is bad, it could be two and a half hours.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, like, you know, we all live in Southern California. We live in...
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Our default airport is LAX, but like that's the main thing we have in common.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: I'm coming from the north, they're coming from the south, so
KAYLA: Meet up at the airport
SARAH: Literally. And like, I want to do stuff with people and I want to invite people places and, you know, do stuff. But also, things cost money and we're at a point in our lives to where like what I can afford might not be the same as what someone else can afford to do.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: That was like when we were trying to do like a weekend thing for my birthday last year, that didn't end up happening.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: That was like part of the thing where it was like, well, I want to do a trip but I… first of all, I don't want it to be too expensive, regardless.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: But like, I also don't want to make it inaccessible.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: To people who are unemployed or, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah, the friends I have here, we've started doing an annual like ski trip because a lot of people ski. Do I ski? No, but I go to that house…
SARAH: I've still have never skied in my life.
KAYLA: I skied like a couple of times when I was very little, like my parents took us. But I just like to go to the cabin and I sit there and I read all day and they go skiing and then they come back and I say, “good job, you look like shit now, but okay.” Anyway, though, it does make it… We have gotten to a point where we're like extremely conscious about the cost and we do like payment plans for each other.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: We like do surveys to make sure everyone is comfortable, whatever. But it does make planning harder when you're like, “I know that some of you make double my salary and I know that some of you make less,” and then it just makes it… But I think that's…
SARAH: But it's not like you have one like super, super, super rich friend who is just going to pay for everyone
KAYLA: That's just going to pay for everyone, yeah
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: So, I think that's the point I was making is that like you were saying about you want to meet up with people, but that costs money. And like the…
SARAH: Mm-hmm. There are certainly some things, you can go to a park and play cornhole, but you have to own cornhole.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But like, you know, even like cheap things like that's… eventually at some point that's going to get old. Also, you have to eat, like even if you’re bringing your own food
KAYLA: Also, because like obviously someone can always just like come over to your house and you can hang out.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: That's not how you meet people, though. Like if we're talking like baseline issue of loneliness, how to fix
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: Like there's a lot of like…
SARAH: Invite strangers off the street into your home.
KAYLA: I know. Like there's a lot of cool, creative ways that people are trying to get around this. Like, speed-friending, like pitch your friend events, stuff like that. People are like trying, at least like in cities, I've seen stuff like that. So, like maybe there are some free ways out there to like meet people effectively, you know, join a fucking rec league or something, that costs money too.
SARAH: Yeah, it costs money
KAYLA: Anyway, there's like ways or whatever. But I think building a friendship costs money, building a friendship or relationship of any kind costs money up to a certain point
SARAH: As an adult
KAYLA: Until when you're comfortable enough with someone for them to just come sit on your couch in silence for a couple of hours. Like that is something you have to build to, which like for me, I have a partner. So that's built, like I already… I paid my college tuition to meet my partner.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: And now here we are and I can be not lonely for free. Like it costs my rent for us to live together. And then that's, whatever
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: But if I didn't have that and I was lonely, it would cost money to fix that problem. Like dating is not free.
SARAH: Right. And that's also not to say that people who are in relationships can't still be lonely
KAYLA: No
SARAH: Because they absolutely can.
KAYLA: Oh, yeah.
SARAH: Whether or not they live with their partner, whether or not they're long distance with their partner. Like, you can obviously still can be. But you at least have a person built in who is supposed to be something to you.
KAYLA: Yeah. And not that that person should be your only socialization
SARAH: Of course
KAYLA: We've talked a lot on this podcast about the importance of friendships and having many different social resources. But I mean, that's just part of the inherent privilege of being in a relationship is that you hopefully have someone built in to like fix that social need
SARAH: Or to help with that social need
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Yeah, I just… I think the world is so fucking expensive. And one of the problems, I think, is that in the past, existing as a human was so community-based.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: You had a community… you had a band of nomads you would rove with.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: You had an agricultural community where you'd come together at the town square and play hopscotch, I don't know. But it's… you know, you would have multiple generations in one house, like helping each other raise children. And people are so… part of it, I think, is the fact that women have more power and more control over their own lives, which is unequivocally a good thing.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: However, it does mean that there are fewer people who have to rely on community.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And so those built-in bonds and communities, you have to put more effort into them to maintain them because they're not automatic anymore. And I think between that and fucking social media…
KAYLA: Well, that's what I was going to say, too, is like not to be like, “phones and technology are ruining our lives,” but something I've thought about a lot the past couple of times I've traveled, like specifically in airports, is you go to your terminal and then you just sit there on your phone for like an hour waiting for your plane. And I was like, “what did people do before?” Like they had a newspaper or a book or whatever, and they just talked. And that's why your grandma is like, “I met your grandfather on the train.” It's because what the fuck was there to do but talk to the stranger next to you?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: And that's why like people complain now that it's so hard to meet people in person and it's just because we don't do that anymore.
SARAH: And that's also… not to bring up the hot spicy issue of the Gen Z stare. For those of you who don't know, the Gen Z stare is, here's… there are two definitions of Gen Z stare. One of them, which many Gen Z-ers will tell you, is if you come up to them and you say something stupid as fuck and they just look at you because what the fuck did you just say?
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: A lot of people interpret it that way, I don't think that's what… that's not what I'm talking about here.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: What I'm talking about here is the situations where you walk up to someone in a social situation, the most common example is in a store and you ask a question and they just fucking stare at you.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: They do not respond. And then they're like, “I don't owe you an answer.”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Girl, you work here.
KAYLA: Yeah. Well, I think…
SARAH: Like, what are you talking about?
KAYLA: That to me also seems like a severe pandemic issue. If you have someone that went through their formative teen years in the pandemic
SARAH: Mm-hmm
[00:30:00]
KAYLA: Imagine going from a child where it's, do not talk to strangers, you're in your house, you form your brain and now you're outside of the house and suddenly you're an adult and people expect you to answer, that seems not good developmentally.
SARAH: Right. And also, it's just like because people are now like they think it's uncool to do small talk, which small talk is fucking annoying at times, yes.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But I think there is... It contains something that is important to the essence of humanity, which is that we can just like say shit to each other.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And it doesn't have to be… like, you know, we can communicate in a way that is meaningful because it's not meaningful.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: And that is the basis upon which communities are built. Obviously, those connections grow deeper and whatever and blah, blah, blah. But within a large community, you're not going to know the deepest, darkest secrets of every single person unless you're in a cult.
KAYLA: Ooh, scary
SARAH: And even then, you're not going to know the deep, dark things of the cult leader, that's the whole thing.
KAYLA: True, that's the whole point.
SARAH: So, like because these communities are less automatic, they're not as inherent to the world that we live in now. And because of social media and because people… it's easier to move across the country away from small or what remains of a community that you might still have. You can move across… you can do what I did and move across the country by yourself without a partner, like, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Because of all of that, it makes sense that people are more lonely
KAYLA: Oh, yeah. I mean, it makes like…
SARAH: Like, of fucking course we are.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And so many people just turn to romantic relationships as like, “oh, this will fix this.”
KAYLA: Yeah. And then it's like you wonder why the divorce rate is so high and it's like, “well, people are desperate.”
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: I also… I looked up… I was curious if there was like scientific links between loneliness and spending money
SARAH: Uh-huh
KAYLA: I didn't find like too much hard science. I did find an interesting like actual study, because there's a lot of talk about loneliness and physical health, like heart health, things like that and I think that has been relatively proven. So, there was a study that found that loneliness has… there's an association with health care expenditure, that the lonelier or the more you spend on like health issues, which makes sense. So that was like the hardest science I found, was that study. But in general, it was just a bunch of blogs of people generally agreeing that lonely people are sad and a way that a lot of people fix sadness is shopping because…
SARAH: To get a spike of serotonin.
KAYLA: Yeah. And that's just… we are so inundated with buying things and very specific algorithms and ads at this point…
SARAH: Everything is so targeted.
KAYLA: Right. That, of course, if you're lonely and you're just sitting there on your phone, of course you're going to spend money on stuff. Like, of course, you are.
SARAH: That's also the danger of… I mean, not to get into A.I., but like…
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: You know, that A.I. app that's like, “we'll be your friend.” Girl!
KAYLA: Yes. I mean, yeah, it's the A.I. relation…
SARAH: It's exploiting
KAYLA: Yeah, it's the A.I. dating. It's the, “I'll be your A.I. friend.” It's exploiting and it's scary because then also now that machine has your data that you're telling it. Or like using A.I. as your therapist, like it's all…
SARAH: My therapist is through like an online thing.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: And they recently emailed being like, “hey, we now have an A.I. thing where you can talk to an A.I.” and I was like, “go fuck yourself.”
KAYLA: Nooooo, no, no, no, no
SARAH: Go fuck yourself.
KAYLA: Absolutely not.
SARAH: Fuck yourself.
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: Like, why are you encouraging this? Like, obviously, it's through their system.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: So, like, it's not going to be the same as if you just like talk to ChatGPT
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: But like you shouldn't be encouraging people to do that.
KAYLA: No, that's really sketchy.
SARAH: And they're like, you know, you can like use it like in addition, like when you can't talk to your therapist, like you want… But it's like…
KAYLA: Get a journal
SARAH: Slippery…
KAYLA: Get a journal, simply buy a journal. Don't even buy one, just write in your Notes app or whatever.
SARAH: Yeah. So, I think all people are punished financially in our society.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: But I think when you don't have community, whether that community is a single person that you're in a relationship with or whether that community is a broader community, it's worse.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And I think this also goes hand in hand with the fact that people in relationships, especially if they have kids, are more likely to be friends with people in relationships who have kids.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And so, the older you get, the more likely a person who remains single is to lose what community they had or feel like they're being pushed out of what community they had.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And then that could, in turn, lead to them being like, “I'm going to buy an Xbox.”
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Also, if you're a single person and you live by yourself, you can't buy stuff wholesale because you're one person.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Perishable, like, I don't have a Costco membership.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Because it's not really useful to me. I do buy large quantities of eggs, but…
KAYLA: I was going to say, you could… I mean like toilet paper and paper towel or stuff like that, maybe, but…
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: I remembered what I was going to say, is thinking specifically about aspec people too, even if you are an aspec person who dates or has sex or whatever, I think there is a financial punishment for just the non-normativity of the way that aspecs go about relationships, like the escalator way of going about a relationship is just so heavily subsidized and like…
SARAH: Mm, say more
KAYLA: Like, okay, say you're like a poly person, you're dating more than one person, like you can't legally get married, like a lot of people end up making an LLC to like share money and like buy a house together, that's like a whole fucking weird thing.
SARAH: Assets, yeah
KAYLA: If you're someone who decides just to be long-term domestic partners, not get legally married now, it's like you have some protection but not others.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: Yeah, I don't know.
SARAH: No, that's very true. And also, you know, if the expectation is you get in a long-term relationship and you move in together.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: If you move in together that's going to be cheaper on the whole, because, you know, a one bedroom apartment shared by two people, it's going to be half as much per person as a one bedroom apartment with one person in it.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And even if you do have sexual and/or romantic relationships, if you go about them in non-normative ways, if you live separately, because it's better for your relationship if you live separately
KAYLA: Yeah, or if you have like separate bedrooms
SARAH: Yeah, or separate bedrooms.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: If you're poly and like you… some of you maybe live together, but not everyone because of the way the constellation of relationships pans out, that's a possible disadvantage because you're not doing what society incentivizes.
KAYLA: Yeah. Well, also just like getting into real specific stuff, but then just like the legal fees of like when we talked to David Jay or like Rhaina Cohen about like co-parenting children or like multiple sets of parents with children and then it's we're doing adoption fees, we're paying to like do, whatever, it's just like what are we doing?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Being queer is just expensive. Being queer is expensive in general.
SARAH: Yeah. Existing is expensive.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: Getting a poopy cat is expensive.
KAYLA: Yeah. Well…
SARAH: Anyway, bring back community.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: Not the TV show, I mean, I guess maybe the TV show, I never watched it.
KAYLA: I didn't either, but I know that people are hungry for the movie.
SARAH: Yeah, I've heard it's quality stuff
KAYLA: People crave the movie.
SARAH: People crave that good, good community. Also, I mean, that's… I think I mentioned this before, like that's a large appeal of like found family in media. That's, you know, a large appeal of fan fiction of like, oh, I like to read fan fiction because in this like alternate universe, like look at all these friends that this person has, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Fiction in general, whether it's fan fiction or not.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So…
KAYLA: I mean, there's a whole… I haven't looked into it much, I've just seen kind of the hype around it, but there's an app, I forget what it's called, maybe it's just simple as live with friends or something. But it's like a real estate app for if you and your friends want to buy houses or rent apartments near each other, like finding houses, which that's like a good thing, I hope that they're not charging like a shit ton of money to use that service or whatever. But that's cool, I guess.
SARAH: Yeah. I wish I lived close to all my friends.
KAYLA: You could just move to Boston.
SARAH: I still wouldn't live close to all my friends.
KAYLA: You'd live close to like a couple.
SARAH: Yeah, but then I have other friends that are in other states.
KAYLA: Yeah, well, I can only… I don't know how to help you with that.
[00:40:00]
SARAH: Anything else to add?
KAYLA: Make things free.
SARAH: Fast and free buses.
KAYLA: Fast and free buses.
SARAH: I don't actually like buses, I get carsick
KAYLA: Actually, I was getting carsick on my bus today, but I have recently been… I used to be a bus-hater and like the train-better but living in Boston, the trains here are so fucking ass.
SARAH: Oh, yeah, it’s because you live in Boston.
KAYLA: Yeah. But in the bus, I take the bus to work and it's so reliable, so
SARAH: That's good.
KAYLA: But I did get a little bit almost carsick on the bus today. But in fairness, I was wearing a turtleneck and that was my bad.
SARAH: I wanted to wear a turtleneck today and then I put it on and I said, “no, I can’t do this.’
KAYLA: I did not… I was wearing a turtleneck under this sweater.
SARAH: Oh, wow
KAYLA: I was wearing so many layers because my office is fucking freezing and no one will do anything about it. We keep complaining and they keep saying it's fine and it's not. So, I was like, “fine, I'll wear thermal layers to work.” But then on the bus, I was wearing my coat and a sweater and a turtleneck.
SARAH: Buses can get hot, man
KAYLA: And I had just taken my medication without food because I'm stupid and there was teens on the bus and so then I was very fearful, but it was okay.
SARAH: Yeah, I wanted to wear a turtleneck today because it was like a high of like 64 and I was like, “fuck, yeah, I can wear a turtleneck.”
KAYLA: It is time.
SARAH: And I put it on and I was like, “sensorily, I cannot handle this today.”
KAYLA: Yeah. I just need… I probably just need to buy looser… the turtleneck I have, I've had for too long and it probably is just not the best fit for me at this time.
SARAH: Anyway, okay
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: What's our poll for this week?
KAYLA: Do you feel financially punished? What's a free way to fix loneliness?
SARAH: To make friends as an adult?
KAYLA: As an adult.
SARAH: Because like when you're in high school or grade school, like at school you don't have to pay for.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: It's a different situation.
KAYLA: Yeah. As an adult, how do you make friends for free?
SARAH: I need more friend. But then if I get more friend, when am I going to see friend? Because I am so busy, even though I don't do anything.
KAYLA: You need roommate or you need person that live directly next door, I think is what you need.
SARAH: Also, you think about like Friends, the Big Bang Theory, like obviously them like living near each other is like for like story purposes. But like there is a reason that those shows went on for a really long time and obviously it's because of the writing and the acting, but like there's something aspirational about that.
KAYLA: Not to brag, but that is currently the life I'm living, like all of my friends live within like a couple of blocks or like streets of each other.
SARAH: Wow. What if I hung up on you?
KAYLA: And it is nice.
SARAH: What if I hung up on you?
KAYLA: I just told, if you would just move here, it could be you.
SARAH: What if I hung up on you?
KAYLA: It seems like it makes the edit harder for you, I don't know.
SARAH: Yeah, it would. So, I won't be doing it
KAYLA: Okay, well…
SARAH: Because that'll save me time to not have to do it. And then with that extra time, what will I do? Not make friends. I don't know. Okay, are you financially… do you feel financially-attacked? Probably. Kayla, what is your beef and your juice for this week?
KAYLA: Mmm, my beef is the moon.
SARAH: Mmm.
KAYLA: I have chosen to blame… I've been having a major crash out this week, I have been deeply unwell this week.
SARAH: Woo-hoo
KAYLA: I think I've cried at work perhaps every day this week.
SARAH: Oh, no
KAYLA: LOL. I think my boss is getting sick of me because she knows I'm just a big crybaby. And so, I'll go into her office and I'll say, “I'm not going to cry this time.” And she's like, “okay.” She literally… I’m this poor woman, I don't think she knows what to do with me, because I literally said that to her the other day, I was like, “I'm going to tell you about this thing and I'm not going to cry because I already cried about it yesterday.” And she just went, “okay.”
SARAH: Well, what else was she supposed to say?
KAYLA: No, and truly. And we could blame this on a lot of very relevant things that are probably the cause of what's going on, what I will blame it on instead is the supermoon
SARAH: Mm-hmm, very super
KAYLA: Because what the fuck is she doing in my sky?
SARAH: I did see the moon when I left work today.
KAYLA: How did it look?
SARAH: Like a moon.
KAYLA: It's the Beaver moon, I looked it up
SARAH: Oh. Does it give a damn?
KAYLA: Does it give a damn? It's the closest the moon will look this year or something.
SARAH: I mean, it looked like big and full, but not like, you know how like sometimes the moon looks like, well, why the fuck is the moon? Is it going to get closer? You know?
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: It wasn't like that.
KAYLA: Oh, that's weird. Maybe it was last night that it would have looked the closest.
SARAH: I don't know.
KAYLA: Anyway, fuck the moon. I don't mean that, she's going to come for me, the moon is a lesbian and I like a lesbian.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: My juice is that I really like a caramel apple and my grocery store sells them, and so, sometimes I'll get them like during the fall they just like have them in little containers.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: But then I saw that my grocery store just sells like caramel dip. So, I was like, “huh?” So now I have a little tub of caramel dip and so I just cut up a little apple and I dip my little apples in it, like a McDonald’s kid
SARAH: You can do the ratio as you please.
KAYLA: Yeah. And I don't know what it is about an apple that make caramel taste so good, but it’s so yummy.
SARAH: Mm, was that both?
KAYLA: I'm done, I'm done now.
SARAH: Right, that was both. My beef... Why is this? This wasn't going to be my beef. But this mole I have on my leg is feeling like it's getting taller and that's usually not a good thing.
KAYLA: No, we should definitely get that checked out, perhaps
SARAH: By who? God
KAYLA: A dermatologist, what the fuck is wrong with you?
SARAH: You think I have a dermatologist?
KAYLA: You should, your skin is fucked.
SARAH: I have an allergist, that’s a big step already.
KAYLA: Okay, well you should really get that checked out.
SARAH: Anyway, I'm probably not dying. My beef is I was supposed to go to the dentist on Monday and they called me on Friday to confirm and I was like, “yeah.” And then I left work and I had to go make a fucking detour in Beverly Hills to pick up my Adderall and then I drove up to my dentist's appointment and I got there and I was 10 minutes early like a boss. And then I got there and I went to open the door and it was locked and I said, “hmm.”
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: But it was 1:50, and I was like, “maybe they're on lunch.” And so, I wait a little bit longer and like the blinds are open and the lights are off in like the lobby, but the lights have been off when I've been there before because there's like big windows. And so, a lot of times they'll just like leave the lights off/I think they're like an automatic thing, so if there's no one in the lobby, the lights won't be on.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: So, I was like, okay, that doesn't necessarily mean anything. And I could see like a light in the back and like the light by the desk was also off. But again, I have been there when that light has been off and people have been there and working.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: So, I'm waiting, and it gets to be the time, no one shows up. Then I wait about five minutes more and then I give them a ring on the telephone and it rings and then it… like rings through and then it like seems to forward me to something. And then it's like, “this call may be monitored for quality assurance purposes.” And I was like, “okay.” And then some guy picks up and he said the name of my dentist. And I was like, “hey, I have an appointment at 2:00, I'm outside, the door is locked.” What?
KAYLA: Hello.
SARAH: And he was like, “oh,” he was like, “what's your name?” And he something, click, clack, clack, clack. And he was like, “oh, okay, I will let them know that you're there and they should come out shortly.” And I was like, “okay.”
KAYLA: Weird
SARAH: So, I hang up, I wait a couple of more minutes, a couple of more minutes, nobody has come to get me, my teeth are still dirty. And so, I call again and it does the same thing and I realized the second time, I think it was like one of those like after hours answering services.
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: So, it was like a guy who like answers phones for a living, but not only for them, like not specifically for them, which was why he like didn't know that much.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And so, I was like, “hey, I talked to you earlier, no one has come out, my appointment was supposed to be 15 minutes ago. They confirmed it on Friday.” And he was like, “okay.” So, then he like, he tried to call someone and then he came back, he was like, “yeah, the person you're trying to reach is unavailable, what message would you like to leave?” And I was like, “I'm supposed to have an appointment right now, so, I don't know what message I would leave.”
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Like, I don't know what the message would be.
KAYLA: Yeah. What am I supposed to say to that?
SARAH: And so he goes, “well, okay, I've let them know that you're here and I've marked it as urgent and I've explained the situation.” And I was like, “okay.” But like he obviously can't do anything more.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, I wait like two more minutes and then I'm like, “I'm leaving, I'm going home.” Because there's clearly no one here.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And then I was like… because they had called me on Friday to confirm, but they had called me like close to 6 p.m., which like, okay, end of the day, like they're confirming their Monday appointments or whatever.
[00:50:00]
SARAH: But then now then I was like, did I misunderstand? Did they call me to cancel it?
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Like did they call me to reschedule it? But then I was like, okay, well, if they were calling to reschedule it, they would have rescheduled it with me on the spot.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like, why would they say, “we're going to reschedule. Bye.” Like…
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, I had this experience, it has been two days, I haven't heard a damn thing from the dentist.
KAYLA: Are we sure this dentist exists?
SARAH: I was there. I have seen two different dentists in L.A. The first one I did like, but I couldn't because then they didn't take my insurance.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And I've been thinking about possibly changing my insurance because I'm already paying six hundred dollars a month, why not add another hundred?
KAYLA: Jesus Christ!
SARAH: Because right now I have like the super cheap dental insurance where it's like 15 bucks a month but like I have to pay like one hundred and fifty dollars for cleaning.
KAYLA: Good Lord.
SARAH: So, I was like, I could get a different insurance and go back to the other dentist.
KAYLA: You might have to, it doesn't seem like this dentist exists.
SARAH: And like I could call them and be like, “what the fuck?” But like part of me wants to like wait and see if they if they call me.
KAYLA: Fair.
SARAH: So that's my beef. I had another beef that I thought but I forgot. My juice is… oh, my other beef is that, you know, those place and bake cookies that have the shapes on them?
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: I’ve been trying to find them, I can't fucking find them anywhere.
KAYLA: What the hell!?
SARAH: I haven't been to my main grocery store yet, but I've been to multiple other stores, fucking nothing, which is probably good because my beef/gravy is that there were some cookies at work today.
KAYLA: Dangerous
SARAH: Because there was some street something happening yesterday and so my coworker got free cookies and I ate them and I ate too many of them.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Because I don't have self-control.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And then I said, “wow, I've eaten a lot of cookies.”
KAYLA: Mm hmm.
SARAH: A third cookie has hit the tower.
KAYLA: Oh, no.
SARAH: And I told my coworker, I was like, “if I eat another cookie, you have to murder me.” And this company doesn't have an H.R. department. So, like you can do it however you want.
KAYLA: That's the problem I have with work is we have a lot of candy at work.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: And people have been bringing in even more candy because they have like extra Halloween candy. And so, I'm just eating candy all day every day at work.
SARAH: Yesterday, I ate four Starbursts at 10 a.m.
KAYLA: Oh, yeah, the early morning candy I am eating at this job is… the breakfast candy I am consuming is not good.
SARAH: And then I felt too full of sugar so I had to have a snack to offset it.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm, yeah.
SARAH: Yeah, because my boss brought in the candy that he'd had for Trick-or-treaters because they got zero Trick-or-treaters. Anyway. So that's my gravy, like I like good cookies, but like I can't control myself from, you know, eating them forever and then feeling regret.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: You can tell us about your beef, your juice, you can answer our poll on our social media @soundsfakepod. We also have a Patreon, patreon.com/soundsfakepod if you'd like to help fund our housing.
KAYLA: Fund my wedding, please, I am poor.
SARAH: Fund Kayla's wedding. Fund Sarah's rent. Yay. And also, my health insurance.
KAYLA: I'm going to set up a special wedding registry just for the listeners of this podcast.
SARAH: Do it.
KAYLA: And then I'll set up a Sarah Rent registry.
SARAH: Please give me dollar. Hey, at least this month, my automatic rent payment went through and it didn't say, “girl, you don't have enough money.”
KAYLA: I accidentally… my rent check overdrew my account this month.
SARAH: Oh, no
KAYLA: And I was like… it's just because I hadn't moved my… I was stupid with where I had put my money, I had made a mistake, but I said, “oops.”
SARAH: Oopsies. Yeah, I could pay it this month because some of the people who owed me money for concert tickets had paid me. Although I do have a friend who still owes me money and I'm like, “girl, you can give me...”
KAYLA: Oh, I owe someone money, I think.
SARAH: “You can pay me your eight hundred dollars whenever, just don't forget about it.”
KAYLA: Yeah. I think I owe someone Airbnb money.
SARAH: Anyway, patreon.com/soundsfakepod, our $5 patrons who we are promoting this week are Tanner Shioshita, Vince Terranova, Vishakh, and vocalanesthesia.
KAYLA: That's a fun name.
SARAH: Thank you.
KAYLA: Thank you.
SARAH: Our $10 patrons who are promoting something this week are Johanna, who would like to promote being kind to one another. Kayla's dad, who would like to promote Jandi Creations. KELLER bradley, who I don't think has told us, but I'm not going to check right now. So, if you have, I'll say it like three times next week.
KAYLA: A fair trade
SARAH: Maff, who would like to promote the Don't Should sweatshirt. And Martin Chiesl, who would like to promote his podcast, Everyone's Special and No One Is. Our other $10 patrons are Purple Hayes, Quartertone, Barefoot Backpacker, SongOStorm, Val, Alastor, Ani, Arcnes, Benjamin Ybarra, Clare Olsen, Daniel Hutchinson, Derick & Carissa, Elle Bitter, Eric and my Aunt Jeannie. Our $15 patrons are Ace, who would like to promote the writer Crystal Scherer, Nathaniel White, who would like to promote NathanielJWhiteDesigns.com. Kayla's aunt Nina, who would like to promote katemaggartart.com and Schnell, who would like to promote accepting that everyone is different and that's awesome. Our $20 patrons are Changeling & Alex, who would like to promote their company Control Alt Access, Dr. Jacki, Dragonfly, JASC and River. JASC, that's my mom, I was reading it directly instead of interpreting it.
KAYLA: Oh, I was wondering, I was like, “I don't think I've ever heard of that person.”
SARAH: That's her initials. And River, who would like to promote utilizing nuance in your daily life.
KAYLA: Mm
SARAH: Thanks for listening, tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.
KAYLA: And until then, take good care of your cows.
[END OF TRANSCRIPT]