Ep 372: Listener Lore pt. 7
SARAH: Hey, what's up? Hello! Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aro-ace girl (I'm Sarah, that's me.)
KAYLA: And a bi-demisexual girl (that's me, Kayla.)
SARAH: Talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else we just don't understand.
KAYLA: On today's episode: Listener Lore.
BOTH: Sounds fake, but okay.
SARAH: Welcome back to the pod.
KAYLA: Hi.
SARAH: Hello.
KAYLA: I just remembered something I saw in the comments of one of our episodes recently that made me have a little giggle.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Someone commented on it, it was like an episode in the hundreds, I think. I think it was called the demisexual experience or something like that and it was me talking about demisexuality. So obviously that is years old and was before I started identifying as a bi-demisexual girl. And I just saw a comment from someone that was like, “I think I'm demi but…” like they were talking about… this is also a public comment, I'm not like exposing this person.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: But they were basically talking about how they think they're bi-demisexual. And they were like, “is that a term I could use for myself?” Like bi-demisexual, and I was like, “bitch, just wait.”
SARAH: Just you wait
KAYLA: Just wait a couple hundred episodes and we'll be there together.
SARAH: A couple hundred!
KAYLA: Just get through a couple hundred more and we'll be there together, bitch.
SARAH: Ah, love that for the class.
KAYLA: Anyway, I'm sad.
SARAH: Oh, sorry, like I know why you're sad, but my brain was trying to connect why you were sad about that and I was like, why?
KAYLA: No, that was pretty chill. I mean, I'm sad about personal things and also the world, which is why we're doing listener lore today, because I said…
SARAH: It's time to distract Kayla from the evils.
KAYLA: Yeah. I was like, I feel like we did Reddit too recently and we shouldn't be doing so much silly and then I said, the world needs whimsy.
SARAH: The world needs silly. You know what’s stupid?
KAYLA: Everything
SARAH: I listened to the podcast, Pod Save the World and last week, they were talking about this interview or speech or something that Macron did at Davos. But he had had some eye, something was wrong with his eye, so he was wearing these blue sunglasses. I haven't even seen a picture of it, I've only heard it described. For some reason, one of the hosts, Tommy, could not stop laughing at the sunglasses, like he was losing his shit, like he could not keep it together.
KAYLA: Good.
SARAH: And then this week in the episode, I guess some people got mad about him laughing at the sunglasses and he was like, “look, I'm sorry. I'm not going to apologize. I needed some levity in my life, they were funny.” And I guess their producer got them some blue sunglasses
KAYLA: Oh my God, wow
SARAH: And then they were podcasting in the blue sunglasses.
KAYLA: Should we start? Do you think like I would feel better if I started just like wearing a fun-colored sunglass around? Like to work.
SARAH: Maybe.
KAYLA: Just like some purple tinted shades. Should that be like my thing? Oh, yeah, see, you look like way more like LA podcasts now.
SARAH: I would like everyone to know that I had within one foot of me, a pair of…
KAYLA: Those are sick, I like those a lot.
SARAH: Yeah. They were the VIP, part of the VIP gift at the Seventeen concerts.
KAYLA: Damn, those are sick.
SARAH: I have two pairs of them.
KAYLA: I'm telling you…
SARAH: Wait, do you want my other pair?
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: I don't know where it is, but if I find it, okay.
KAYLA: Give that to me.
SARAH: Because I have two because I was a VIP for two different concerts.
KAYLA: Put it in the mail, I want them. Wait, I must have them because then this could be us every week.
SARAH: Oh my God.
KAYLA: Sarah, this could be us every week.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: I must have them.
SARAH: Well, I don't know where the other ones are because… I'll find them.
KAYLA: She's just looking around, she's just looking at anything within arm's reach.
SARAH: They're somewhere, I'll find them.
KAYLA: Okay. I can't wait.
SARAH: Anyway.
KAYLA: Okay, do we have any housekeeping?
SARAH: No, that was our housekeeping.
KAYLA: Okay, great, consider your house kept. So today we will be doing listener lore, which if you're new to this series is we ask our listeners to send in…
SARAH: Kayla, what are we talking about this week? Okay, now keep going.
KAYLA: Listener lore. And so, we ask our listeners to send us in silly stories about aro-aceness or just life kind of a la wild Reddit story, it's like our own personal Reddit.
SARAH: Yes.
KAYLA: I will put the link to the form you can fill out if you want to share a story in the description of this episode.
SARAH: Yippee.
KAYLA: Let's begin.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: This is from someone named Cornbread.
SARAH: Hi Cornbread!
KAYLA: She/they
SARAH: She/they
KAYLA: This one made me giggle out loud. They say, so I was taking a pathophysiology class...
SARAH: Okay, smart, I've never met a Cornbread that smart.
KAYLA: At my high school.
SARAH: What!?
KAYLA: At high school, pathophysiology at high school.
SARAH: Do you go to like a STEM high school?
KAYLA: They must, because my high school is not offering any of that.
SARAH: Certainly not.
KAYLA: Anyway… Oh, sorry, for this specialized class that I believe was only offered because the last anatomy teacher wanted to teach it. Okay, well, there you go, we should read before we start screaming.
SARAH: Well, I'm glad that the last anatomy teacher like got to do that.
KAYLA: Yeah, good for them
SARAH: Like hey, I really want to teach this and then the school administrator said, sure.
KAYLA: I love that.
SARAH: And there was enough demand that people took it? I love that for the class.
KAYLA: I know. I was working with a lab group, I was working in the lab.
SARAH: Wait, sorry. What's the kind of class?
KAYLA: Pathophysiology.
SARAH: What does that even mean? Brain body?
KAYLA: Something… I mean, something vaguely anatomy-related, I have to imagine. Let's look it up while we're here.
SARAH: I interpreted that as brain body.
KAYLA: Pathophysiology. Pathophysiology, a disordered… I can't even read science words. The disordered physiological processes associated with disease or injury. So maybe it's like anatomy, but for like… let me pull up the Wikipedia.
SARAH: Brain body.
KAYLA: A branch of study, at the intersection of pathology and physiology, concerning disordered physiological processes that cause, result from, or are otherwise associated with a disease or injury.
SARAH: That's exactly what I said.
KAYLA: It's not.
SARAH: It's like the other day when I couldn't remember…
KAYLA: It's not what you said!
SARAH: It's like the other day when I couldn't remember the word for narcolepsy, so I looked up fall asleep disease.
KAYLA: Yeah, that one was good.
SARAH: And then I sent that to my cousin who has narcolepsy.
KAYLA: I still don't quite understand like what this is.
SARAH: It's okay, we don't have to, we're not in the class.
KAYLA: That's right.
SARAH: We’re also not in high school.
KAYLA: It has basically nothing to do with this story, it's just the setting.
SARAH: We really got hung up on there.
KAYLA: Yeah. Anyway, I was working with a lab group that was a bunch of girls a year older than me. On this particular day, we were filling out a lab report on blood types… Okay.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: My group were talking about which boys at the school they thought were cute.
SARAH: I'm O positive.
KAYLA: I don't know my blood.
SARAH: You should learn.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: In Korea, now they're way more into MBTI
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: But previously their like big like pseudoscience about human compatibility was about blood types.
KAYLA: So, they just went from one pseudoscience to another?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Great.
SARAH: But I was watching an interview the other day where like they asked like the idols, they were like, “oh, what's your blood type?” And they all just knew off the top of their head because that's like something that people might ask you.
KAYLA: Interesting.
SARAH: In the same way that they would ask you like what your MBTI or what your...
KAYLA: Like what your star sign is?
SARAH: What your star sign is, yeah.
KAYLA: Wait, now I want to research blood type compatibility. It doesn't even matter though because I don't know my blood. Okay, anyway.
SARAH: Wait, can I say one more thing? No, I won't. Keep going.
KAYLA: I haven't even gotten through the first paragraph.
SARAH: I was going to change the topic so wildly.
KAYLA: Oh.
SARAH: Keep going, keep going.
KAYLA: I, an asexual who rarely experiences aesthetic attraction, was not getting involved. At one point, one of the girls in my group...
SARAH: Sorry, what were they talking about?
KAYLA: Enough! They were talking about which boys were cute.
SARAH: Okay. No, because I thought it was about something similar, but then the next sentence, I wanted to make sure I was fully understanding what was going on, continue.
KAYLA: Insane. At one point, one of the girls in my group was struggling with the chart of blood donation comparability, okay, so I helped her out. In an effort to compliment and possibly make me feel more involved, she said, “you're so smart, if I were a guy, I'd totally get with you.” To which I responded by looking awkward. So, she added, “or a girl, I don't know what you are.” I just went, “neither of those. I am neither of those.” She paused for a moment, and then, “if I were nothing, I'd get with you.” This was the same girl who months later, following a talk with some firefighters, disappointedly said, “the cutest one there was a girl,” looks pointedly at me.
SARAH: I like how the way it's phrased, it almost seems like they're talking about Cornbread's gender, but they're not. They're talking about the genders that Cornbread is or is not.
KAYLA: “If I was nothing, I'd get with you.”
SARAH: “If I was nothing, I'd get with you.”
KAYLA: That kills me.
SARAH: Wow.
KAYLA: I love that, inclusive queen, thank you.
SARAH: She was trying.
KAYLA: And you know what? Like you do actually have to hand it to her. Okay, this one is kind of a long one, and I've only really seen the first and the last sentence, but I'm hooked already.
SARAH: Great.
KAYLA: This is from Tacocat. Oh, Tacocat.
SARAH: Tacocat, hey you!
KAYLA: This is going to really change, I think, a lot about how I think about Tacocat, if I'm going to be honest with you, I think this could really change a lot of stuff for me.
[00:10:00]
SARAH: Change everything? Okay. I'm ready.
KAYLA: I don't know if it's in a positive or negative way yet, but I just feel like after this story, I'm not going to feel the same.
SARAH: We’ll find out. Okay.
KAYLA: This is the story of my Alfredo sauce beanie.
SARAH: Okay, before we start, I'm picturing a beanie full of Alfredo sauce.
KAYLA: I think you might be right.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: But we have a lot to get through…
SARAH: I can't wait.
KAYLA: So, I'm going to need you to focus up.
SARAH: It's really hard for me to do that, but we'll try.
KAYLA: Over the summer, I went on a day trip to NYC to see a former marching band member who plays piano for Hadestown on Broadway. Slay.
SARAH: Ooh, tea! I assume it was someone who was in marching band with you…
KAYLA: I have to assume so
SARAH: But you did just say a former marching band member, which is really broad and vague.
KAYLA: It is. I, too… it could have been me, I'm a former marching band member.
SARAH: Exactly, it could have been me.
KAYLA: You were not in marching band.
SARAH: Yes, I was.
KAYLA: I thought you were just in concert.
SARAH: I was in marching band freshman year because my mom made me, and I hated it.
KAYLA: You're a fake. You're a fake. She's fake. I didn't know all the years.
SARAH: Hey, marching band was zero hour at my school, dude.
KAYLA: That's crazy, I just stayed after school.
SARAH: And I was doing gymnastics. Well, that was when I broke my back the first time, it doesn't matter, keep going.
KAYLA: It was me, my mom, my sister, and her boyfriend. We took a bus to the city, which was about three hours away from our hometown. We saw the show, which was absolutely incredible and the guy I knew was amazing.
SARAH: I was wearing my Hadestown hat today, sorry, keep going. Listen, I'm here to cheer you up, I'm here to bring you joy.
KAYLA: You know what? Your Hadestown hat actually might come into play here.
SARAH: Oh my God.
KAYLA: We bought a bunch of Hadestown merch at the show, including a canvas bag and the beanie in question.
SARAH: Okay, mine was a baseball hat.
KAYLA: The canvas bag to carry the rest of the merch.
SARAH: Does it have the flower on it?
KAYLA: How could I know?
SARAH: Okay, well, my baseball bat had… My baseball bat?
KAYLA: Your baseball bat has the Hadestown flower on it.
SARAH: My baseball hat has a flower on it.
KAYLA: I mean, I assume it has the flower on it, what else would it have?
SARAH: I don't know.
KAYLA: The problem occurred after having a quick dinner with a pianist at a small Italian place that had gluten-free pasta. I have a bunch of dietary restrictions, so the combo of gluten-free and using an enzyme mix allowed me to presumably eat a chicken alfredo dish, which was much bigger than I could eat in that short amount of time before his next show. You maybe see where this is going. We packed up the alfredo in a takeout container and it went in the canvas bag. We left to go to where the bus my mom ordered tickets for, walking about 20 minutes to find absolutely no buses. We realized that my mom probably ordered scam tickets and tried to find another way home, walking to Grand Central Station. That's when my stomach started to cramp, the enzyme mix apparently was not strong enough to fight garlic, onion, and dairy in the alfredo sauce, and I was in agony the entire 30-minute walk back to Grand Central Station.
SARAH: Oh, no!
KAYLA: I felt a bit better after taking some medicine and going to the bathroom, but I come back to the group to find that there are no buses or trains that go back to anywhere close to my hometown until the morning.
SARAH: Oh, no!
KAYLA: And it was around 7 p.m.
SARAH: None? Is your hometown in the middle of nowhere?
KAYLA: I mean, the bus schedules are like so bad. Well, I guess, or train, I don't know.
SARAH: Not a train either, yeah.
KAYLA: I started panicking because not only do I have work the next day but I don't have all of my medications on me, most notably my anxiety meds. While I love Broadway, my social, anxious, and autistic ass hates NYC or most big cities, so I was actively fighting a panic attack at this point. Thankfully, my sister's boyfriend called his family, and his dad offered to drive an entire five to six-hour round trip to come get us and bring us home, that’s sweet.
SARAH: That's very sweet.
KAYLA: But now we had three hours to kill and places started closing. No, they didn't, you're in New York, it's 8 p.m. Respectfully.
SARAH: Respectfully, Tacocat
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: Maybe like in Grand Central Station, I don't know.
KAYLA: I mean, I guess, I don't know what kind of places you were looking for, so I don't know, my bad. We found somewhere with seats and everyone… I guess, yeah, somewhere you can just like sit, I guess that would close. All right, I take it back.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: We found somewhere with seats and everyone else got something to eat, but I just got a water bottle. Soon though, we had to leave because they were closing soon, that's when I opened the canvas bag and found that the Alfredo sauce had leaked in the bag, ruining the playbills and covering my new beanie.
SARAH: Not the playbill.
KAYLA: We tried our best to clean it up with fast food napkins, but there was only so much we could do until we were home. We got home fine, but we're so tired, we decided to wash the Alfredo sauce mess in the next morning.
SARAH: I have a question.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: Was it like really watery Alfredo sauce? Because I feel like if it's like a thick Alfredo sauce it's hard for that to leak, so the container would have had to completely open but if it’s like a thinner sauce...
KAYLA: I'm picturing one of those just like Styrofoam boxes, I feel like those can open super easily.
SARAH: Yeah, that's true.
KAYLA: So yeah, I don't know.
SARAH: Also, they've been walking all over New York, it's been being jostled.
KAYLA: I know. A big mistake, we ran the bag and the beanie through the wash twice and thought that was it. When I later went to wear the beanie, it still smelled strongly of Alfredo sauce. No worries, we just wash it again, it comes out a little fainter, but still definitely smelling like Alfredo sauce. And then soaked it with a stain and odor remover, left it overnight to sit before washing it again, this time it passed the smell check and was stored until it was actually cool enough to wear a beanie. About a month later, I wore it to work and left it in my locker with my sweatshirt, when preparing to leave, I got the tiniest whiff of something, you guessed it, Alfredo sauce. Somehow it was still under there, but I couldn't smell it until the smell of the odor and stain remover faded. At this point, I just gave up, so I now own a Hadestown beanie that permanently smells ever so faintly of Alfredo sauce.
SARAH: It's an Alfredo hat.
KAYLA: The world has decided that it will never let me forget that chaotic mess of a day trip by reminding me every time I wear this beanie and get a whiff of that damn Alfredo sauce. I am currently wearing it as I tell this story.
SARAH: I mean, is the bag also still smelling of Alfredo? Is it like an Alfredo bag and an Alfredo hat?
KAYLA: That's a good question, there is a couple more sentences with a few answers to questions they expect, but nothing about the bag, so.
SARAH: I mean, depending on how it spilled, it may have been less on the bag...
KAYLA: It seems like the beanie may be really caught a lot of sauce.
SARAH: Yeah, the beanie caught the brunt of it.
KAYLA: No, I will not stop wearing it, it was too expensive. Yes, it has been washed several dozen times and it still won't reverse the scent.
SARAH: Several times!?
KAYLA: I cannot use any type of strongly scented detergent because I'm allergic. Yes, it was incredibly good chicken Alfredo and I was very sad to have to throw it away even if it made me sick.
SARAH: At least it smells like a good memory, you know?
KAYLA: I don't know that it is a good memory, it seems like a very traumatic day.
SARAH: It smells like a memory that you can gaslight yourself into thinking was good because it was tasty.
KAYLA: Yeah, that's true.
SARAH: And you got to see your friends, you got to see Hadestown, it was really good.
KAYLA: I am really glad to hear that it tasted good because as soon as they said that it made them sick, I was like, “well, I really hope it was worth it,” because I feel like sometimes you can get Alfredo and it's not good.
SARAH: Yeah. Like, we recently got a place… I got a thing with Alfredo sauce and also so did someone else and it was like a weirdly thin Alfredo sauce.
KAYLA: Ew
SARAH: To be fair, we got takeouts so it was not in its best condition.
KAYLA: That should make it thicker if anything though.
SARAH: Right, but it was really thin and so the other person who got Alfredo was like, “oh, this is kind of disappointing,” and I was like, “this is great, it means it's less saucy.”
KAYLA: You're crazy.
SARAH: It's just more like plain noodles, I love this.
KAYLA: You are crazy for that. Okay.
SARAH: So how do you feel that your opinion of Tacocat has changed?
KAYLA: Honestly, I actually… I don't know that it has, the things I saw going into this were, ‘this is the story of my Alfredo sauce beanie’ and then ‘no, I will not stop wearing it, it was way too expensive,’ those are the things I saw that really… I was like, “I must read this.” And so that like, it just really scared me, but I actually think it's okay.
SARAH: Tacocat, have you ever considered just like dumping Alfredo sauce in it and just like scooping it out with a spoon and eating it? Like a bowl?
KAYLA: What!? What is that going to solve?
SARAH: Using the hat like a bowl.
KAYLA: What is that going to solve?
SARAH: It doesn't solve anything, it just really leans into the Alfredo hat.
KAYLA: I get, but it seems like Alfredo is alfredio. Alfredo is a risky thing for them to eat, so I doubt they're doing it on the reg.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: I'm just wondering, is there a smell that could… like what is the opposite smell of Alfredo? Maybe you dump that in the hat and they kind of cancel each other out.
SARAH: Right, it cancels each other out.
KAYLA: What is the opposite smell of Alfredo?
SARAH: Hold on, I'm just going to look up, ‘What is the opposite of Alfredo sauce?’
KAYLA: Perfect. Maybe that like black squid ink sauce that they're doing these days.
SARAH: Well, that's stupid, the fucking AI overview bullshit says, “the direct opposite of a creamy white cheese-based Alfredo sauce is a red tomato-based sauce like marinara, which is light acidic and herb-focused, other contrasting non-creamy options include spicy arrabbiata, chunky meat-based bolognese, or olive oil-based sauces like pesto.” I think the opposite of Alfredo sauce is like…
KAYLA: Not even a sauce.
SARAH: It can't even be a sauce.
KAYLA: Oh.
SARAH: It has to be something so different that it's not a sauce.
KAYLA: Okay, just something really dry, a powder, some seasonings. Maybe season the hat like a cast iron.
SARAH: Turmeric.
KAYLA: Turmeric? I just… maybe pepper, it's black and Alfredo sauce is white.
[00:20:00]
SARAH: But there's probably pepper in the Alfredo sauce.
KAYLA: Yeah, you're right.
SARAH: Maybe like a… just a lot of sugar cubes, maybe some plain Cheerios.
KAYLA: Mm, that's interesting.
SARAH: Because plain Cheerios do have more of a smell than you'd think.
KAYLA: They do have a smell.
SARAH: I know this because I ate them for breakfast every single day in my senior year of high school, I would put them in a little Ziploc and I would bring them to school and I would eat them in class.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: So.
KAYLA: So, consider that. I do think that maybe you should just start putting a lot of things in the hat just to kind of like test it out.
SARAH: Yeah. My suitcase smells vaguely of cat pee.
KAYLA: Oh!
SARAH: I don't… Hey! Stop sticking you claws in…
KAYLA: Oh, the criminal herself is here.
SARAH: Hey! Hey! You can burrow but don't put your claws in there.
KAYLA: Wow, she can't pee in her suitcase, she can't scratch the couch…
SARAH: I have no recollection of her ever peeing in my suitcase.
KAYLA: Mm
SARAH: But I did just start noticing the smell. And at first, I was like, oh, it probably was just because like it had been out and it smelled like cat and… but it won't go away.
KAYLA: I mean, she does have a habit of peeing in places she's not meant to.
SARAH: Well, for a hot second, but she hasn't in a long time. But she does, sometimes when I have it out, she'll like paw at it like you would a litter box. So, I was like, maybe she'd peed in it at some point and I just didn't know.
KAYLA: Cat pee is stinky.
SARAH: So now it just smells vaguely of cat pee. And so recently I was like… because I like wiped it down, it still smelled like cat pee. And so, I put some little sachets of…
KAYLA: Sachets
SARAH: Of… Oh, it's not corn, baking soda. A baking soda in there to hopefully catch some of the smell and we'll see if it does anything.
KAYLA: Well, you know what I think is proven to be what you should do is put alfredo sauce in there.
SARAH: God, that's so true.
KAYLA: Because rumor has it, it'll just smell like alfredo sauce.
SARAH: Nothing like alfredo sauce with just like a splash of this.
KAYLA: New York, concrete jungle…
SARAH: Concrete jungle where dreams are made of… No, literally in my family group chat, only a few hours ago, we were talking about this restaurant we went to in New York one time, it was an Italian restaurant and they were like very serious about their Italian food.
KAYLA: Yeah, they do that
SARAH: And my sister-in-law asked if she… like they came by with like Parmesan cheese and they were offering it to people and they didn't offer it to my sister-in-law. And she was like, “can I have some?” And they were like, “no, it doesn't go with your pasta.”
KAYLA: No. Yeah
SARAH: It doesn't match. And she was like, “okay, fine.”
KAYLA: Bitches!
SARAH: And I was going to ask… what was I going to ask for? I was going to ask for like salt or something.
KAYLA: Yeah, don't do that.
SARAH: And then I was like, I can't, I can't.
KAYLA: I guess you got to start bringing your own salt and cheese to the restaurant.
SARAH: Well, I do have a portable salt that I keep with me at all times now.
KAYLA: Thank God.
SARAH: I know.
KAYLA: Okay, are you ready for another one?
SARAH: I wouldn't be able to bring enough cheese, it would take up too much space.
KAYLA: I know, I need like so much cheese.
SARAH: So much cheese. Yeah, I'm ready for the next one.
KAYLA: Okay, this is from Daniel, He/they.
SARAH: Daniel.
KAYLA: TLDR, I once had a girlfriend for one week without knowing it. Okay, so back when I was 16, around the time I was discovering my aro-ace identity, I had the amazing opportunity to go live abroad as an exchange student for one year. I decided I wanted to go to Austria to learn more German and overall discover the culture.
SARAH: Hallo.
KAYLA: I had an Austrian host family and went to a normal Austrian school.
SARAH: Fantastisch
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: I'm giving all my commentary in German.
KAYLA: Thank you. I know exactly what you're saying, this is going to go great. Around winter break, the class next to ours had a ski trip planned. Sadly…
SARAH: Ach, so Österreichischer
KAYLA: Sadly, one student of that class, let's call her Alice, was at the time injured and could not go, instead of being sent home…
SARAH: Ach
KAYLA: You want to say something about that?
SARAH: It was just “ach”
KAYLA: Instead of being sent home, she got put in our class for the week, that's when I first met her. Alice was nice enough, but she lacked a huge… Sad. But she lacked a huge amount of confidence, never knew what to say or when to say it, and not in a cute shy way. Ah, get her. Alice would overcompensate with trash talking in an overbearing way, oh, okay, fuck that bitch.
SARAH: Ach, nein
KAYLA: She always made me very uneasy, so I just kept a polite conversation so nothing more. One day, she asked me if I was willing to help her study for her French test, I'm from France, by the way.
SARAH: Oh, Französisch.
KAYLA: I struggled to find a valid reason to decline, so reluctantly agreed to meet her in her classroom after school. During this tutoring session, she asked me, “do you want to be my friend?” I clumsily answered, “uh-huh.”
SARAH: I see exactly where this is going.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: I know exactly where this is going, and it is a language barrier problem.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Keep going
KAYLA: I clumsily answered, “well, yeah, I mean, you don't even need to ask, right? Of course we can be friends.” The whole conversation felt odd, but I figured she was so lacking in confidence that she actually needed to ask me to be her friend. The next week, she texted me more and more often, inviting me to various outings like the cinema or to go see her brother's soccer match. I kept declining and finding it… crazy that you called it soccer.
SARAH: They're code switching for us.
KAYLA: Thank you.
SARAH: Fußball
KAYLA: That's very nice of you. I kept declining and finding excuses because I really did not want to spend that much time with her. Well, it was only after talking about this to my Austrian host brother that we figured out what had happened. As it turns out, “will you be my friend?” in German actually means, “will you be my boyfriend?” I had not understood that she had officially asked me to be her boyfriend. Mortified, I thought back to my answer, “well, yeah, I mean, you don't even have to ask, right? Of course we can be friends.” The next Monday, I gathered...
SARAH: But they said, “of course we can be friends.” I'm assuming they said, like, of course we can be befreundet, which is not implying boyfriend/girlfriend, “befreundet” would just be friends.
KAYLA: I couldn't...
SARAH: Unless he said like... No, you wouldn't say “zusammen” in that situation, you wouldn't say together. Continue.
KAYLA: I don’t know. The next Monday, I gathered all my courage to go face her and explain that the language barrier had caused a massive misunderstanding. She seemed disappointed, but understood the issue, and that was that. Luckily, I didn't see her in the halls too often after that. I hope she's doing well and that she too can look back on her one week of officially dating and laugh it off.
SARAH: This is one of... Oh, my God, there's a cat right where my feet go, I didn't realize it.
KAYLA: Oh, no
SARAH: This is a beef that a lot of German learners have with the language.
KAYLA: It seems very confusing.
SARAH: Which is that the word... So, there's the word “Freund,” which is a friend who is male, but it also means boyfriend, because it is a friend that is male, so it is boyfriend. And then there's “Freundin,” who is a friend that is female, but it also means girlfriend.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: If you're non-binary, fuck you. The way you differentiate it in spoken language is if you say, “mein Freund” or “meine Freundin,” my friend, or my male friend, my female friend, that means boyfriend or girlfriend. If you say, “ein Freund” oder “eine Freundin,” a male friend or a female friend, that means a friend who is male, a friend who is female. So, it's in a difference of whether you say, “my” or “a”, but my is “mein” and a is “ein.” So, they don't sound all that different.
KAYLA: I feel like we just need to throw all languages in the trash.
SARAH: Yeah. Well, it's like… I mean, I have a friend who is non-binary who uses they/them pronouns in English, but in German just kind of sucks it up and uses she/her pronouns.
KAYLA: Yeah. It seems very difficult in those languages that use so many gendered words, especially, it seems very complicated.
SARAH: Yeah. And then they're trying to get more woke by like… they do this thing where instead of automatically doing the male version, they'll do an asterisk and then add the female, like to try and be inclusive, but it's still super binary.
KAYLA: Yuck.
SARAH: Anyway, this was a storyteller just for me.
KAYLA: It really was.
SARAH: Thank you for this, I really appreciated it.
KAYLA: Okay. I have a story from Wokndead, who you shall remember from…
SARAH: The car and…
KAYLA: My ex drove my car into the ocean.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: If you don't know that story, was that our first listener, Lore? The first or second, I think.
SARAH: Yeah, it was first or second, it was early.
KAYLA: I mean, simply a classic, you simply must know about my ex drove my car into the ocean
SARAH: It's so good.
KAYLA: You simply must know about my ex drove my car into the ocean. Okay, this is another car story.
SARAH: Oh my God.
KAYLA: They say, yes, I know my lore seems to always be steeped in car problems, but this story is literal fire.
SARAH: Oh, okay.
KAYLA: My first car, a 1981 Pontiac Grand Prix, was a real piece of work. It was two-toned beige-brown, which meant I never had to wash it and never did in the year I had it. It had no dash lights, so I had a flashlight taped to the steering column.
[00:30:00]
SARAH: Oh, good
KAYLA: The ceiling was held up with multicolored thumbtacks. It had a transmission leak, so I had to put fluid in every few days, and it stalled in the rain. Luxurious.
SARAH: Okay, this was a 1981 car, what year did Wokndead have it?
KAYLA: I don't know, it was their first…
SARAH: I feel like it's relevant to know how… it seems like it's a pretty old car by the time they had it.
KAYLA: It was their first car, they said. I don't know how old… Wokndead is old enough to be divorced...
SARAH: Anyone can be divorced. Hold on, I’m…
KAYLA: So, they're at least 19 or 18
SARAH: They have children!
KAYLA: Okay, then at least 20 something…
SARAH: Hold on. I'm looking in Discord, but I don't think they go by Wokndead anymore.
KAYLA: I don't really want to be just saying their age on the internet.
SARAH: That's fine, but I personally want to know.
KAYLA: Just look up like car in ocean, and you should find it
SARAH: Car ocean, oh, okay, I'm trying to click on the name, and it won't fucking let me.
KAYLA: I mean, to me, this is obviously not a new car.
SARAH: No, it's not, but I think it really just adds…
KAYLA: I suppose.
SARAH: Oh my God, they told me what time signature that song is in.
KAYLA: Huge.
SARAH: Okay. Here's what we're going to do.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: I'm going to tell you what age range…
KAYLA: I don't know that we should be saying that.
SARAH: No. Okay. Also, another reason I wanted to check is Wokndead uses she/her pronouns now, so.
KAYLA: Love.
SARAH: Because I was like, I think their pronouns changed, so I wanted to check. What we're going to do is I'm going to say what age group she has on her Discord, we are going to ask her if it's okay to say on the podcast, and if it's not, I will bleep it.
KAYLA: All right. Sorry, I'm trying to be so respectful and good.
SARAH: I'm being respectful and good.
KAYLA: I'm being respectful and good.
SARAH: Okay. So, Wokndead is in the 40 to 49 age group, which means… let's average it at 45, that means that they were born in 1981. So, this car was at least 16 years old.
KAYLA: Yeah. And it does seem that way, doesn't it?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: That's what I wanted to include.
KAYLA: All right. The car treated me pretty well considering until one fateful day when I had to go to mandatory high school graduation rehearsal. I got in my car that morning and started backing out of the driveway, I smelled something odd, so I stopped and looked around. Down by my feet, there was a bunch of smoke, so I turned off the engine and got out.
SARAH: That's a good start, turning off the engine and getting out.
KAYLA: That is a great start. And that's when I saw there was a small fire building up behind my front tire. Bits of it were dropping down to the ground, so my thought process was, well, that's not good, and started stomping out what fell. I eventually decided that wasn't helping, so I went back inside.
SARAH: Inside the car?
KAYLA: No. And back inside the house, I assume.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: As I was coming in the door, my mom was coming down the stairs and said, “did you forget something?” I said, quite flatly, because that's just who I am. “No, I think there's a small fire burning in my car.” My mom looked out the dining room window to see the entire front of my car engulfed in flames. She panicked, and I went up to my room where I had front-facing windows and could see what was going on. Mom accidentally called the police because she apparently forgot the fire department number. Do they have a specific number? Am I stupid?
SARAH: Not like a 911 number, but you can... Okay, remember when I had the situation where someone in my office set the dumpster on fire?
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: And I initially called the regular fire department number, and they said, “no, hang up, call 911.”
KAYLA: Interesting, okay.
SARAH: Yeah, it's for like less emergency emergence
KAYLA: I guess I have called the non-emergency number and been directed to the fire department before.
SARAH: Yeah, they have a number.
KAYLA: It was because my landlord was trying to poison me with carbon monoxide.
SARAH: Delinquent.
KAYLA: I guess they weren't trying, but they didn’t not try.
SARAH: Anyway, Wokndead, I think your mom should have probably just called 911.
KAYLA: I think the 911 was just fine. I called my friend Jen, Jen picked up, and I said, “hey, can you pick me up?” She said, “yeah, what's up?” And I said, in my usual flat tone, “my car is on fire.”
SARAH: And it is still actively on fire.
KAYLA: “What1?” “My car is on fire in my driveway.” “Well, that explains all the fire trucks going past my house.” “Yeah.” Meanwhile, my sister had gotten to the house and came running up the stairs. “Are you okay?” I said… oh, the sister asked, “are you okay?” I said, yes, and turned back to my phone. So, can you pick me up? Look, this was a mandatory graduation rehearsal, so I had my priorities.
SARAH: Hold on. Can I just say, at my graduation rehearsal… it is mandatory, they're always mandatory.
KAYLA: We did not have one.
SARAH: Our rules were that if you don't show up to the rehearsal, you don't walk at graduation. Like, you could still get your diploma, you just couldn't be in the thing.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And there was one person who did not go to the rehearsal, but they did end up letting him walk, you know why?
KAYLA: Car on fire?
SARAH: The reason he missed is because he was a volunteer firefighter.
KAYLA: Oh.
SARAH: And there was a fire.
KAYLA: And that's a pretty good reason. Now that I think about it, I don't think we had an official rehearsal, we just had like a big meeting where they were like, this is how you do it.
SARAH: I mean, we didn't like all walk across the stage in the rehearsal.
KAYLA: Did you have your graduation in your school or was it at a separate location?
SARAH: No, we had it in a soccer dome.
KAYLA: We had ours at a, I feel like it was maybe Oakland building, I don't know.
SARAH: You went all the way over…
KAYLA: No, we must not, there's no way.
SARAH: It was like by my house.
KAYLA: Yeah, we must not. It was like something like that, though. Maybe it was like a hockey rink.
SARAH: That would make sense.
KAYLA: I think it was a hockey rink. Anyway, rehearsal first, car problems later, one of the neighbors had run over with a bucket of water at some point and said, “this isn't going to do it.”
SARAH: No. Does anyone have a fire extinguisher?
KAYLA: Fire extinguisher. I mean, if your whole front of your car is up in flames, though, I don't know if that's going to help
SARAH: Okay, at the beginning it would have helped.
KAYLA: Yeah, that's true, it would have.
SARAH: Not anymore, but you know.
KAYLA: Fair. The nice fire guys came and washed my car down real good for me and there were bits of metal melted into the asphalt.
SARAH: Hey, you said that you never got your car washed and they washed your car.
KAYLA: They did.
SARAH: Free.
KAYLA: I had filled my gas tank the day before, so it's extremely lucky the fire stayed at the front. I did make it to rehearsal only slightly late. The moral of the story is there are definitely better ways to convince your parents to repave the driveway. Good. Funny. Good.
SARAH: Wow
KAYLA: Will she ever have a car that works and that isn't driven into the ocean? That is my question.
SARAH: I think the one that was driven into the ocean worked just fine.
KAYLA: It did, it seems to have worked very well, too well.
SARAH: It worked so well it was driven into the ocean
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Oh, man. Incredible. Kayla, what is our poll for this week?
KAYLA: What is the wildest car problem you have ever had?
SARAH: I've never really had a wild one. My Lord and Savior, the late Little Blue Rolling Turd, smelled like cheese because someone spilled lemonade in it.
KAYLA: Wait, what? I was about to be like, oh, you know, like alfredo sauce? And then you really hit me with a doozy.
SARAH: For my sister's grad party, we went to Penn Station to get some gallons of lemonade to serve at the grad party and on the way home, one of them fell over and broke open and got in the back of the car and for some reason, it made the car smell like cheese.
KAYLA: So maybe Tacocat, you put lemonade in the hat.
SARAH: Lemonade in the hat.
KAYLA: Maybe think about that.
SARAH: Specifically, from Penn Station, if you can access it.
KAYLA: Yeah, maybe think on that.
SARAH: Are there Penn Stations within three hours of New York?
KAYLA: I don't even know what that is.
SARAH: It's like a hero… What are the normal words for a hero? A sandwich? A grinder? A sub?
KAYLA: A sub
SARAH: A sub, it's like a sub place.
KAYLA: Interesting.
SARAH: Penn Stations locations, they're in 15 states. It's based in Ohio.
KAYLA: 15 or three hours from New York could be one of many states.
SARAH: Penn Station subs locations map. No, I don't think there's one within three hours of New York.
KAYLA: Too bad, you'll have to travel for it if you really care about that hat.
SARAH: Yeah. It looks like mostly it's like Michigan, Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Kentucky, West Virginia, a couple by Pittsburgh, a couple in Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, one in Georgia and Tennessee and then a couple in Missouri and then… I think those are all in, I don't think those are in Iowa, I think those are in Nebraska and Omaha or whatever the one is, maybe Lincoln? This is really important, I need to figure out what city that is, it's Omaha, okay, whoa!
[00:40:00]
KAYLA: Thank God.
SARAH: Lincoln and Omaha are near to her. Anyway.
KAYLA: I don't think I have had any wild car stories, I've been in some upsetting accidents, but none that are like fun.
SARAH: It's crazy that they're called Penn Station East Coast subs, but it's mostly in the Midwest.
KAYLA: Not on the East Coast, that is weird.
SARAH: Like the furthest East ones are in like Richmond, Virginia or something.
KAYLA: They're liars.
SARAH: Okay. So yeah, tell us about your weirdest, strangest car experience and let us know if anyone has ever driven your car into the ocean.
KAYLA: Yeah, let's rehash that one.
SARAH: Or like a pond or a lake or a river, a swamp.
KAYLA: If you go back real far in the discord, there are pictures of the car in the ocean from the news.
SARAH: Of the car in the ocean.
KAYLA: In the news, so…
SARAH: We have evidence that it's real.
KAYLA: I have to assume that we don't have a picture of the car on fire or else I feel like they would have mentioned it, but if there happens to be, I'd love to see it.
SARAH: Also, I'm running on the assumption that this is like the late 90s, maybe early 2000s.
KAYLA: Getting out the digital point and shoot.
SARAH: Right. You're like, “oh wow, the car is on fire, let me go get my camera.”
KAYLA: Maybe.
SARAH: I want to take a Polaroid of this.
KAYLA: Disposable camera, you're like cranking it?
SARAH: Yeah. It's not like you had a camera in your telephone. Or maybe… well, Wokndead was like calling their friend Jen.
KAYLA: It could have been from the landline though.
SARAH: It could have been like a flip phone.
KAYLA: Yeah, but they probably… I feel like teens had landlines in their rooms.
SARAH: That is true. It could have been like an early flip phone with a really bad camera in it.
KAYLA: Maybe, I don't know.
SARAH: I feel like maybe it was a landline though.
KAYLA: I think it was probably a landline. I would not give my 90s teenager a flip phone, that would probably be so expensive.
SARAH: Yeah, it would be.
KAYLA: Or am I rich?
SARAH: My mom had a bag phone.
KAYLA: What?
SARAH: It's like, technically it's a cell phone because it is portable, but it's basically like a phone in a… you carry it around in a bag, it's like large.
KAYLA: What is the point?
SARAH: Well, it's portable.
KAYLA: Yeah, but like you're really getting that many calls on the go that you must carry this giant bag?
SARAH: I don't know, it's probably good for like emergencies.
KAYLA: It reminds me of like the old car phones they used to have, those were huge.
SARAH: Yeah. A bag phone, let me make sure that I'm not making this up.
KAYLA: I kind of hope you are.
SARAH: Yeah. No, it's a phone in a bag. It's literally, it looks just like a landline in like a leather bag.
KAYLA: I just kind of like… was your mom like really getting a lot of calls?
SARAH: Um, I don't know.
KAYLA: I just feel like I couldn't be fucked to carry something so big around just for no one to call me.
SARAH: They were manufactured between 1988 and 2000.
KAYLA: We should bring these back.
SARAH: Maybe she was like, “oh my God, my two-year-old child, Sarah, just did something really impressive. I got to call everyone I know.”
KAYLA: “Let me get my bag open.”
SARAH: “Let me just call everyone I know.”
KAYLA: “From my bag phone.”
SARAH: Kayla, what's your beef and your juice for this week?
KAYLA: My juice is that I'm going to a Heated Rivalry club night on Friday, so I'll have already been by the time you listen to this and I had fun.
SARAH: Can I jump in with my juice?
KAYLA: I guess.
SARAH: Tomorrow I'm going to a Heated Rivalry viewing at a bar.
KAYLA: Which episode are they playing?
SARAH: The Rose episode, it's going to end and it's going to be so dramatic.
KAYLA: The episode really stresses me out.
SARAH: Also, my other juice that I'm going to say that's relevant, and then I'll let you go back to doing your beef and your juice, is that I did in fact get tickets to the fifth Heated Rivalry rave in LA.
KAYLA: Thank God.
SARAH: I did have to get the most expensive tickets, I'm not entirely sure who I'm going with yet, but I do… It's happening.
KAYLA: Huge.
SARAH: Continue with your beef and juice. Thank you.
KAYLA: I guess that's my juice. One of my beefs is that I don't know what I'm going to wear because I don't want to spend money on getting like a themed outfit.
SARAH: I told her to wear her bear onesie because in the books the Boston team are the Boston Bears.
KAYLA: Yeah. But I get too sweaty. My other beef is fascism.
SARAH: Yeah, I don't like that very much.
KAYLA: No, I can't say I'm a fan.
SARAH: No, I think it's pretty bad.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: I also think it's bad when the Second Amendment is only for people with the same political views as you.
KAYLA: That's so interesting, I didn't know we were doing that.
SARAH: Right, that's news to me. So that was my juice, not…
KAYLA: Not that.
SARAH: I already did my juice previous to fascism. My other beef that is much more minor, a different level of beef than fascism is I was peacefully in the shower the other day…
KAYLA: You’ll never catch me being peaceful in the shower, I hate that place, fuck that.
SARAH: Okay. I was actually… I was done showering, I was just enjoying the warm water and maybe if I had gotten out sooner than this wouldn't have happened, but I heard a crash.
KAYLA: Oh.
SARAH: And I saw a figure run away.
KAYLA: A figure!?
SARAH: Lo and behold, my child Adderall had knocked my bottle of iron supplements onto the ground.
KAYLA: Noooo!
SARAH: Now, if this were a regular plastic bottle, it would have been fine, it would have gone bouncy, bouncy, bouncy, it was a glass container.
KAYLA: Oh, bougie, bougie
SARAH: Which is crazy because they're like not that expensive. So, it's like, damn, you're like… you're splurging for the glass container. Anyway.
KAYLA: Crazy, I guess
SARAH: And I had actually dropped this container once before, but I think I dropped it on the rug and I was very afraid when I dropped it that it would explode, but it didn't, but it was just priming to explode this time. So, she knocked it off the counter and it broke and then there was glass shards all over my floor and then I had to just get out of the shower, and there I am in the nude…
KAYLA: Wet.
SARAH: Wet. I can't see because I'm not wearing my contacts.
KAYLA: A trap she set for you.
SARAH: And I have to clean up this… And I couldn't even put the iron pills back in the remains of the like jar container because not only had the top broken off, but there was a hole in the bottom.
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: So, I had to go get a mason jar to put my iron pills in and I had to just go around all of the glass and I had to make sure I didn't have any glass in my iron pills.
KAYLA: Yeah, you don’t want that, you’d be swallowing glass
SARAH: I mean, if you have glass in your iron pills, like, I mean, that's like, it probably strengthens your arteries or something, I'm not sure.
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: I think doctors might recommend it but…
KAYLA: Right.
SARAH: Like my doctor didn't recommend it so I thought I would avoid it. I did get to use my new vacuum cleaner.
KAYLA: Huge.
SARAH: To vacuum the glass up that was not the big pieces.
KAYLA: Maybe she just knew you were excited about your new vacuum.
SARAH: But Addie kept… it's cordless.
KAYLA: Ugh, jealous.
SARAH: But Addie also kept trying to come back in and like walk all over the glass.
KAYLA: Oh, helpful
SARAH: And I was like, “girl, you're going to hurt your toe beans and then I'm going to have to touch your toe beans.”
KAYLA: And she wouldn’t want that
SARAH: And you know what she fucking hates? Having her toe beans touched. And so, if I have to touch her toe beans, I'm going to lose an eye.
KAYLA: One time, this was years ago, I came home from work to find like blood in my shower, and I was like, “yo!” And it was because Billy had like knocked my razor off the like little ledge in my shower and must have like stepped on it and then her beans bled and I was like, “brother! no.”
SARAH: Brother! One time my aunt came home and her cats had turned on the vacuum cleaner.
KAYLA: One time I came home and the maintenance people had closed the door to where the cat litter was so my cat had pooped in the shower and peed on my purse, I had to throw that purse away because cat pee is stinky.
SARAH: As established.
KAYLA: As established. And I didn't know about the Alfredo hack back then.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: So, you can see where my problems lie.
SARAH: Was it an expensive purse?
KAYLA: Yeah, it was like leather from Italy from like the time I went to Italy, so I was just like, well.
SARAH: Oh, no. But that also means like it really soaks in because it's like real leather
KAYLA: Oh, yeah. It was like real nice leather, so I was like, “well, I guess, bye.”
SARAH: I think you can sue the repair person.
KAYLA: Yeah, it was tough, it was a tough loss.
SARAH: Anyway, you can tell us about your beef, your juice, your thoughts on fascism on our social media @soundsfakepod. We also have a Patreon, patreon.com/soundsfakepod if you want to support us there. I texted Kayla the other day and I said, “do we have money that we can pay out in the Patreon? Because I'm poor.”
KAYLA: You are directly funding Sarah's concert ticket funds because…
SARAH: Listen, I'm a nice Midwestern girl and I will buy the tickets and then you can pay me back whenever you can.
KAYLA: However…
SARAH: And I stand by that. However, sometimes that means that you're out like twenty-five hundred dollars.
KAYLA: Yeah.
[00:50:00]
SARAH: Because you've told people that they can just pay you back when they can and then you're like, “oh, no, I don't have money.”
KAYLA: “I don't have any money.” So, you all saved Sarah's life.
SARAH: So, you text Kayla and you say, “hey, do we have money in Patreon?”
KAYLA: “Can I have money, please?” “Money, please.”
SARAH: Anyway, our $5 patrons who we are promoting this week who I would like to personally thank for your contribution to my bank account is Simon, Snordstorm, Sofia P., Tall_Daryl and Tom S. Our $10 patrons who are promoting something this week are my aunt Jeannie who would like to promote Christopher's Haven. Johanna, who would like to promote being kind to one another. Kayla's dad, who would like to promote JandiCreations.com. KELLER bradley, who would like to promote… I still don't know, the complexities of the German language because keller means basement.
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: And Maff, who would like to promote the Don't Should sweatshirt. Our other $10 patrons are Martin Chiesl, Purple Hayes, Quartertone, Barefoot Backpacker, SongOStorm, Val, Alastor, Ani, Arcnes, Benjamin Ybarra, Clare Olsen, Danielle Hutchinson, Derick & Carissa, Elle Bitter and Eric. Our $15 patrons are Ace who would like to promote the writer, Crystal Scherer.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: Sorry, Ace has a has a real name in parentheses so that I can keep track based on what the name on Patreon is and I somehow started combining words.
KAYLA: Oh, good.
SARAH: And so, then it became Aiice. Nathaniel White who would like to promote NathanielJWhiteDesigns.com. Kayla’s Aunt Nina who would like to promote katemaggartart.com. And Schnell who would like to promote accepting that everyone is different and that's awesome. Our $20 patrons are Changeling & Alex, who would like to promote their company ControlAltAccess.com, and Dr. Jacki, Dragonfly, my mom, and River, who would like to promote finding someone who can sign a death certificate.
KAYLA: Ew, Jesus Christ!
SARAH: Thank you for listening, tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.
KAYLA: And until then, take good care of your cows.
[END OF TRANSCRIPT]