Ep 45: Dating as an Asexual Person
SARAH: Hey what’s up hello. Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aro-ace girl (I’m Sarah. That’s me.)
KAYLA: And a demi straight girl (that’s me, Kayla.)
SARAH: Talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else that we just don’t understand.
KAYLA: On today’s episode: Asexual dating
BOTH: — Sounds fake, but okay.
*Intro music*
SARAH: Welcome back to the pod
KAYLA: Haaa.
SARAH: Woohoo. So this week’s episode was inspired by an email we received. Kayla, would you like to elaborate on that email?
KAYLA: I would, but before I would do that, I would just remind you -
SARAH: Oh, sorry.
KAYLA: We mentioned this in last week’s episode, we have a survey out, it’s pretty short. If you would like to take it, there’s a link below, please take it.
SARAH: It is going to help us out considerably.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: Wait, we don’t have to include this if we don’t want, but I just still think it’s so funny because several people have been like, your audio sucks and we’re working on that. But one person said maybe it might be helpful if you recorded so there’s less background noise, and I just thought that was funny, because we’ve got to go back in the closet to record this podcast.
KAYLA: It is true though, a lot of people that record music at home record in closets,
SARAH: They do it in a closet. It was a totally valid thing to say, I just thought it was funny, given the context of the pod.
KAYLA: It is funny. Anyway, it would help us out a bunch and your feedback really is appreciated. A bunch of you have said very sweet things. If you would also like to say those sweet things in reviews, that would also be very helpful for us to have good reviews.
SARAH: True.
KAYLA: So anyway, that’s something you can do if you want to help us out. So this was inspired by the lovely email that we got, because we get those sometimes and it’s very nice. Basically they emailed us, and they said some nice things about us, and then they told us that they are a sex-repulsed asexual who is not aro, so they experience romantic attraction, and they are non-binary. They were saying how they don’t have much dating experience, since “the average guy typically isn’t chill with the idea of never having sex” and then they said “but I did have this one date that was just wild. Think Mr Collins and Lizzie Bennet on a date”, which caught my attention, because me and Sarah – So those are characters from the book Pride and Prejudice, and me and Sarah are big fans, so I was like, hell yeah.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: So basically as soon as they got home from the date, they took their laptop out and wrote everything down, because they were like, this was a mess and I want to remember this. They said that we could share this story, so basically they met this guy in class –
SARAH: Hold on, can I –
KAYLA: What?
SARAH: Before we get to that. For some context here, I haven’t read this story –
KAYLA: Oh, yeah.
SARAH: Kayla is telling me this for the first time because she thought it would be funner if –
KAYLA: If we got some reactions, so I’ve read this, kind of quickly so I might have also missed things. But Sarah, have you even read this second email?
SARAH: The second email, no.
KAYLA: Okay, so you don’t know any of this.
SARAH: Yeah. So we just thought it would be an interesting thing to talk about someone’s experience.
KAYLA: Right, because we’ve gotten feedback that we don’t talk about people that are not aromantic a lot, which is true, we don’t, because – Well, Sarah doesn’t have a lot of experience with that; I’m not aromantic, but I’m also not ace, so it’s a whole, you know.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: So we thought this would be a good way –
SARAH: And an entertaining way –
KAYLA: Yeah, an entertaining way to talk about that and react to it, and then a little segue into future episodes we do on this kind of topic. But yeah, because this story I thought was funny and interesting, I thought it would be a good way to get someone else’s experience where we don’t have any.
SARAH: Hit me with it, Kayla.
KAYLA: So – Am I allowed to use their name? Hold on. Okay, I’m going to use their name. So this person’s name is Rachel that us sent in the email. Rachel said they met this guy at school, at a very small college and they were in class together, and he asked them out. If there’s quotes in the story, it was actually said, and Rachel’s thoughts are italicized, so I can let you know when there’s thoughts.
SARAH: Amazing.
KAYLA: They also said the guy from the date is almost the spitting image of Mr Collins from the 1995 Pride and Prejudice, but with facial hair.
SARAH: Oh my.
KAYLA: And Rachel’s also been told that they’re likely the child of Lizzie and Darcy because of their awkward and highly sarcastic nature, so honestly, iconic.
So I can read you this, so it’s called Ray and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Date.
SARAH: (laughs) Amazing.
KAYLA: And it’s dated December 21st, 2016. Okay, are you ready?
SARAH: Yes.
KAYLA: “This is quite literally my very first date, and when you’re 20 years old and no guy has ever shown interest in you, you’re probably going to say yes to a date with a guy you’re starting to become friends with. Now, he didn’t have a car, so I drove downtown to pick him up.” Also Sarah, feel free to stop me at any point.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: Just tell me your thoughts.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: “We got to the bowling alley, which was a literal hole-in-the-wall type of establishment. There are children and old ladies here, so it can’t be dangerous.” That was a thought.
SARAH: (laughs)
KAYLA: We bought two games and ended up playing a third. I’m not one for bowling, particularly because I am not skilled at anything that is required for good bowling. I was goofing off, and my lack of proper bowling form was sending him into a tizzy. By the third game, I’d finally gotten him to stop caring about the score, or bowling the right way. I somehow managed to beat him without even caring where my ball went down the lane. It usually went in the gutter.”
SARAH: Iconic. Same.
KAYLA: Me also.
SARAH: Big fan of bumpers.
KAYLA: (laughs) Same. “On our walk to the restaurant for lunch, he stepped on a large square sidewalk drain, causing it to emit a loud, clanging sound. I let out a rush of air and put my hand on my chest, having been startled at the unexpected loud noise. He laughed, ‘Man, you really do scare easy. You’re like a frightened little deer. It’s adorable.’ Okay, cool. We’re romanticizing anxiety. This is great.”
SARAH: (groans)
KAYLA: (laughs) “I spotted the sign for the restaurant. It was another little hole-in-the-wall, more of a hole-in-the-ground because it is in the basement of a building. The pizza” –
SARAH: It was a sinkhole? That’s exciting.
KAYLA: No, it was a hole-in-the –
SARAH: I know.
KAYLA: What?
SARAH: Listen, I’ve been watching a lot of The Good Place recently, I was thinking about sinkholes.
KAYLA: There’s a sinkhole in the parking lot of my work building that they’ve said they’re going to fix all summer and it’s still there. Anyway –
SARAH: Amazing, continue.
KAYLA: (clears throat) “We had been having amazing conversations about nothing, just goofing off, nothing serious. I expected to keep that going, and we did, until he placed both hands on the table and looked at me very seriously.”
SARAH: Oh wow.
KAYLA: “‘I want to take things slow.’ I felt my eyebrow instinctively rise. Um, I’m sorry. What are you referring to?” This is a thought, by the way.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: “Do you want to take a while to order, or do you think we’re in a relationship right now? He then laughs at himself and starts half talking to me, half to himself, saying things like he doesn’t know how someone like me could like him, how he’s so lucky, how he really likes me, and starts complementing me to no end.”
SARAH: It sounds like this this guy thinks they are just already in a committed relationship.
KAYLA: Oh girl, just wait.
SARAH: (laughs)
KAYLA: (laughs) If you think this – Anyway. “I stay silent as he rambles and I look over the menu, growing increasing uncomfortable and avoiding eye contact at all costs. I soon notice it has grown quiet, and suddenly interject ‘What are you getting?’ This diverts his attention to the menu, for which I am most grateful. I shift in my seat. It’s going to be a long meal. The Lord smiled on me that day, and he didn’t return that strain of conversation for the rest of the meal. He did however repeatedly call me beautiful and angel, each of which I responded by making a ridiculous face, sticking out my teeth and crossing my eyes, aw shucks, really? It seemed to do the trick, for the most part. We finished our meal and set out. He had asked if I would like to, but seemed determined to either way, head over to Rosa Parks Circle and watch people ice skate, and hopefully take a few falls. We put some more time in the meter and made the trek over. I was wearing my non-waterproof boots in the middle of a Michigan winter” Girl, why?
SARAH: Michigan?
KAYLA: Why would anyone do that? But yes, Michigan.
SARAH: (pleased) Michigan.
KAYLA: Is Rosa Park Circle somewhere we should know?
SARAH: I don’t know.
KAYLA: It’s probably in Detroit.
SARAH: I’m at the point in my life where any time I hear anything related to the Mid-West, I’m like, oh my God! It’s in Grand Rapids.
KAYLA: Oh, okay.
SARAH: Mmkay, anyway –
(10:00)
KAYLA: Anyway. “But I stayed silent about my cold wet feet, figuring we wouldn’t be long anyway. That was probably my third mistake by now. On our walk there, I finally busted out the question why he would ask me out, knowing I’m asexual. I made clear I was simply curious to understand his point of view on this, and if he even understood what it meant to be asexual.”
SARAH: So this guy knew beforehand? They’d been becoming friends beforehand, and that’s how he knew?
KAYLA: Yeah, it seems like they were kind of friends, class friends maybe, so he knew they are asexual.
SARAH: Also, this is a really long date, what’s happening? They did three rounds of bowling –
KAYLA: So they went bowling, went to lunch –
SARAH: Did lunch, and now they’re watching people fall on ice skates?
KAYLA: Well, they’re about to go ice skating also themselves.
SARAH: Okay, continue.
KAYLA: This is a long date, but I’ve been on – I don’t know. I don’t know. Alright. “Simple question, easy answer. You got this. He went into this dramatic, long-winded response of how sex is over-rated, and not something he finds to be important. He sounded sincere at first, and the longer he talked, the more it began to sound like he was saying what he thought I wanted to hear. As I provided small insights to asexuality and gave him clearer definitions, he started to change his response to fit all too nicely into my world view. Okay, son” –
SARAH: Also, if someone answers a question like that by rambling a lot, I always am a little bit concerned, because I always feel like they’re just trying to make themselves look –
KAYLA: Well it’s like they’re trying to cover for themselves.
SARAH: Right, they’re trying to make themselves look good, whereas if they had a good understanding of asexuality, it would be a pretty short answer. Or if they didn’t, and they wanted to know more, and they were sincere about it, they would ask you.
KAYLA: Well, it’s like they said, simple question, easy answer. But then, nay.
SARAH: Yeah. Snowballs.
KAYLA: Yeah. “Okay son, I just wanted to know what you were thinking. I didn’t need you to start plotting out our lives for the next 20 years. I remained silent as he rambled, figuring his oddly specific choice of the word ‘us’ was just figurative. My blood suddenly ran cold when we were at a crosswalk. He stated for the 9th or 10th time that sex was over-rated, and he was fine going without it if it meant he ‘got to spend his life with me’”
SARAH: Gah.
KAYLA: “Thank heavens I ? a passive expression. I was ready to throw up and pee my pants at the same time. I pretended not to hear it and stashed it away to think over later. Having officially brutally murdered the fun, carefree tone we had going for us when we were bowling, I began to feel a little on edge.”
SARAH: Yeah, understandable.
KAYLA: “I’m determined to Frankenstein this date, no matter what the cost.” I don’t know what that means.
SARAH: I don’t either.
KAYLA: But that is what they thought.
SARAH: Cobble it together?
KAYLA: Perhap.
SARAH: Maybe – Mmkay.
KAYLA: I think I’m just too dumb for the reference.
SARAH: Me too (laughs)
KAYLA: “We stood in the snow watching people skate. No one fell except for a little kid. His hand bumped mine and I moved it instinctively back into my coat pocket.”
SARAH: Retweet
KAYLA: “‘Come on, don’t be like that.’ Wait, what? Did you want to hold my hand? I gave him a thoroughly confused look. He started back up his conversation, mostly with himself, of our future together. Having the brilliant idea that he should ask for my opinion on some of this, he asked ‘So like, how would we have kids?’ I bluntly replied” –
SARAH: Oh my God. Oh my God.
KAYLA: (laughs) And you thought it was bad earlier.
SARAH: Oh my God.
KAYLA: “I bluntly replied ‘I won’t.’ Maybe shouldn’t have stressed the ‘I’ of that statement. Oops. He grew quiet then suddenly said he would be fine not having kids. Whoa, so one second you want kids, and next you’re fine not having them. This is a serious conversation; you don’t take that lightly.”
SARAH: I don’t think this guy has any opinions.
KAYLA: I think this guy has a lot of opinions and is trying to pretend like he doesn’t.
SARAH: You’re right. I think this guy has a lot of opinions, but he’s trying to just go with what Rachel’s saying. He wants to try and change their mind, but not today. Later.
KAYLA: He sounds like – You’ll see later, he sounds very manipulative too.
SARAH: Oh good, cool. We love that.
KAYLA: Love it. Okay. “I suddenly noticed a slight pressure on the middle of my rib cage, under my right arm. ‘Dude, why do you have your arm around me? I have given you no indication that this is something that is okay. What are your thoughts? I need you to spell this out for me.’ I stared straight ahead with my hands clasped in front of me on my middle. My mind was half-involved with any conversation because all I could think about was how he was seemingly playing piano on my ribcage. Why can’t you be more awkward? Just keep your hands still if you’re going to do this. You’re squirming like my cat when she doesn’t want to be held. Kind of like me.”
SARAH: Is that dialogue or was that thoughts?
KAYLA: That was thought.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: Would have loved if they’d said that out loud though.
SARAH: Yeah, that would have been funny.
KAYLA: “He spewed out a sentence in which he gendered me more times than I’ve ever heard before. I instantly remembered a comment he made while bowling. He understood pronoun preference. He knows I’m non-binary. He knows I’m not a girl. He never asked me about my pronouns. My stomach sank in complete disappointment. So you can talk so big about a serious relationship on the first date, but you can’t even bother to respect me through my pronouns?” That’s a thought.
SARAH: What is this guy –
KAYLA: He sucks, dude.
SARAH: But I just don’t why he’s trying so much if he’s very clearly going to respect this person’s gender and sexuality/if he wants to try and change them, you would think he would try and do that from the start.
KAYLA: Yeah, I have no idea.
SARAH: It doesn’t make sense. Continue.
KAYLA: “He made another statement about me being a girl. ‘I’m not a girl’ I said, perhaps too firmly. ‘Fine, an angel,’ he corrected.”
SARAH: Oh, what? Oh my God.
KAYLA: (laughs) I know.
SARAH: See, when you said I’m not a girl, that reminded me of The Good Place again. Guys, watch The Good Place, it’s really good.
KAYLA: This has been an ad.
SARAH: (laughs) Sponsor us –
KAYLA: Sponsor us – The Good Place, please sponsor us.
SARAH: Can The Good Place podcast sponsor our podcast?
KAYLA: Yeah, why don’t you talk to them about that?
SARAH: I will.
KAYLA: Alright, anyway. “Feeling frustrated with his ridiculous and uncalled for language, I reach into my defense kit full of book and movie quotes, and selected an all too fitting passage from Jane Eyre. ‘I’m not an angel and will not be one until I die.’
BOTH: (laugh)
KAYLA: “Wow Ray, conceal, don’t feel’” That was a thought.
SARAH: Savage.
KAYLA: Which, honestly, the fact that they can just whip that – Iconic.
SARAH: That’s amazing.
KAYLA: This person is iconic. “He rolled his eyes and looked at me. ‘Come on, don’t be like that. You know what you’re doing, stop it.’”
SARAH: What? What are they doing?
KAYLA: A thought. “Hold up, do you assume I’m being insecure and rejecting your so-called compliments? No sir, I’m defending myself against your self-centered mind.” Also would have loved for that to be said out loud. “He continued his talk of the future and us and marriage and having kids and being together for the rest of our lives. I slowly retreated into my brain. I seemingly sucked my whole being into my head, leaving my body to operate as a shell, practically motionless. Okay, he still has his arm around you. This is intensely uncomfortable. You could step away right now and end it. Or you could analyze it. Opting for fully dissecting my feelings, I dove in. This is uncomfortable. Why is it uncomfortable? It feels forced. Why does it feel forced? Because I don’t reciprocate. Why don’t you? Because this doesn’t feel right. Why doesn’t it feel right? Because I feel as though I’m on pins and needles, and the fact that I’m almost sweating in 30 degree wind at the thought of someone I know seeing me. Why? Are you embarrassed to be with him? No, I just have to defend myself if they ask why I went out with him. This isn’t something I want. It’s not something I’m ready for, at least not like this. By the time I came out of my head, he was still talking about marriage. Not the idea of marriage, not the topic of marriage. No, our marriage. The two of us. Married. Having kids. Spending our lives together.”
SARAH: That’s even –
KAYLA: That was all bolded, by the way.
SARAH: Even if this person were not (pause) Whoa, sorry.
BOTH: (laugh)
KAYLA: She’s shook.
SARAH: Even if this person were the kind of person who wanted to get married –
KAYLA: With the first date guy?
SARAH: [Who] wanted to eventually have sex with a person, wanted to have kids, if someone says that to me on a first date, I don’t care how much it aligns with things I might potentially want. If they’re going that far on the first date and you don’t already know them really, really well? Even if you did know them really, really well, I would be like, we’ve been friends for five years, why are you doing this on our first real date?
KAYLA: I am someone that wants to get married and have kids, and if someone did this to me on the first date, I would be, what?
SARAH: Gotta go.
KAYLA: I’m busy.
SARAH: Yeah. I’m too busy to get married.
KAYLA: Too busy to marry you. sorry. Anyway, “I stared straight ahead as I had been the whole time and asked ‘How much time did you put in the meter?’ He checked his phone and said it was 4. ‘Do you want to go to my place to get out of the wind?’ My eyes bugged out of my head. Thankfully not literally. I scrambled for a response. I stammered out something along the lines of seeing what time it was when I got back and how I should leave within the half hour. Smooth Ray, nice job making him think you aren’t totally disgusted by him. On our way back towards my car and his apartment, I felt something hit my hand as his flew past. Um, that’s a bit of an obvious swing in your step. ‘Hold my hand,’ he said, like a command.”
(20:00)
SARAH: Ew.
KAYLA: A thought “I ain’t taking that crap. I threw my head back and gave out the most toddler temper tantrum groan of frustration imaginable.”
SARAH: Hold on, can we take a moment to appreciate the double-meaning of ‘I ain’t taking that crap’? The crap being his actions, but also his hand.
Kx Oh my God.
BOTH: (laugh)
KAYLA: Mmm, yes. Maybe we should do a separate podcast where we just dissect this through a literary analysis. We become a literary analysis podcast for an episode.
SARAH: Amazing.
KAYLA: Iconic. So they had a temper tantrum. “Okay, that should make him reconsider or at least ask me this time. No, he grabbed my hand and attempted to entwine our fingers. I’m wearing leather gloves, good luck getting my fingers to separate enough for yours.” A thought. “I left my hand limp as he flailed around in a poor attempt at being romantic. He suddenly stopped. ‘Okay, we need to fix this.’ He starts to break down how to hold a hand. I internally roll my eyes” –
SARAH: Ohhhhh.
KAYLA: I know. Bitch, we all know how to hold a hand.
SARAH: Is he just trying to mansplain how to hold someone’s hand to a fully grown adult?
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: (retches)
KAYLA: (retches) “I internally roll my eyes as he finally settles on holding my hand. I couldn’t walk fast enough, really appreciating my long Dutch legs. Why do you have to be so short? We somehow ended up going to his apartment, and I went on Instagram while he used the bathroom. I saw a funny video and he asked what I was laughing at. Kid, what the freaking heck is fricking wrong with you? He had put his arm around me again and was holding me tighter this time. We were standing in the middle of his apartment.”
SARAH: Wait, so you’re standing and he’s just like holding –
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Oh my God.
KAYLA: I continued to ignore it and geek out about the video, hoping he may just stop. I noticed the time was 4:16 and blurted ‘I should probably go.’ I took a fraction of a step to the side to release myself from his grip while he awkwardly spun around to face me. His arms were open, perhaps going in for a hug. I started to respond with a hug back, but his hands landed on my shoulders. ‘No,’ he simply stated. No? No what? Are we just going to stand here like this? Let me go.” That was a thought. “I froze, half bent to the side for a hug. He laughed, his hands were firmly planted. I didn’t think I could move even if I tried. I was really confused and starting to get scared. I’d no idea what was happening. I didn’t feel unsafe, I just didn’t have a clue what was going through his mind. He took a deep breath and said ‘So, first kiss.’” Dammit, I’ve ruined it. “So he said ‘First date, how about your first kiss?’ You would be correct in that it would be my first kiss, but I don’t appreciate your assumption. Still frozen in this awkward position, I managed to make a face. I’m pretty sure I look like I just sucked on a lemon. Mostly wincing, I squeaked out a small ‘Nuh-uh’”
SARAH: Nuh-uh.
KAYLA: (laughs) I know, iconic. “‘You sure?’ ‘I’m sure.’ ‘Not even a small kiss?’ Shaking my head, ‘Nuh-uh’. ‘Not even a small peck?’ Shaking my head more. ‘Nuh-uh, nuh-uh, nuh-uh.’”
SARAH: This is a horrible person.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: This guy is just ,ugh.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: And it also seems like he’s physically stopping them from –
BOTH: Leaving.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Which is like, um?
KAYLA: Uh, what? Nope. “After a beat, he finally released me and my body turned to mush as I was finally able to move again. I took a deep breath, realizing I had been holding it the whole time. He was still staring at me like a wounded puppy. ‘Sorry,’ I winced. I’m not actually sorry, but please just stop looking at me like that. It won’t make me change my mind. ‘No, don’t apologize, I don’t want to make you uncomfortable.’ Oh, a little late for that, bucko.”
SARAH: Yeah, bucko.
KAYLA: (laughs)
SARAH: You’ve been doing that all day.
KAYLA: “‘Where’s my car?’, suddenly realizing I hadn’t parked in front of the building. He offered to show me to my car. He didn’t try to hold my hand or touch me again, for which I was immensely grateful. I silently said a small prayer of thanks. We said our goodbyes, which were nice and short. I got in my car and [he] walked away. I sat unmoving in my seat. I tried getting my keys into the ignition and finding my phone for the GPS. I was moving like a snail. I started shaking. I had a heart palpitation and then I took some deep breaths. It’s over. You’re completely fine, nothing to worry about. After another deep breath, I cranked my radio and drove home, desperately praying I would figure out what the frick to do next. But it turns out there was something to worry about. He texted me three days later, talking like we were in a relationship. After a week of this and my family’s concern for my safety, my sister hijacked my phone and typed out a really nice break-up text for me. That’s right, I broke up with someone I’d never been in a relationship with.”
SARAH: Here’s the thing too, it’s not like he texted that night or the next morning, acting like they were in a relationship. No, he waited three days and still had the audacity to act like they were in a committed relationship.
KAYLA: He followed the three-day rule, but then –
SARAH: Took it way too far.
KAYLA: “And he told our whole class, 19 people, that he went on a date with me. I found out three weeks after the date, and decided that so long as he was bragging about going on a date with me, I could brag about having the greatest story ever.”
SARAH: Oh my God, amazing.
KAYLA: “The end.”
SARAH: Please tell me that that person told everyone in their class about what happened on this date?
KAYLA: I wish. I don’t think that happened.
SARAH: Yeah, I don’t think so either, but it would be amazing.
KAYLA: But it would be amazing.
SARAH: Wow, that’s a lot.
KAYLA: Yup.
SARAH: That’s also just like – I feel like there’s so many people out there who claim to be allies, and claim to be people who are like yeah, I’m totally cool with this, but then as soon as you actually test them, there’s just like, it was all a farce.
KAYLA: Well yeah, it’s like they’re just saying they’re an ally to make them look cool.
SARAH: Like a good person.
KAYLA: And then they actually have no idea what the fuck they’re talking about.
SARAH: And it’s like, I don’t want to assume that everyone’s like that, because I know that that’s not true, but it’s just so disappointing.
KAYLA: This guy sure was.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Yeah, wow.
SARAH: Wow.
KAYLA: So, your thoughts?
SARAH: But I also, I totally empathize with Ray for being like, I don’t know how to get out of this, for that classic Mid-Western, ‘I don’t want to be rude’, because I feel like some people are going to criticize them for that, but it’s like if I were in their position, I don’t think I would have done any different.
KAYLA: I’ve definitely been in uncomfortable situations, maybe not this uncomfortable, but uncomfortable situations where I just stay in it because I’m like, well I don’t want to be rude.
SARAH: Don’t want to be rude, and it would be too difficult and too confrontational to get out of it.
KAYLA: Right.
SARAH: In a way that isn’t organic to how it would normally be.
KAYLA: Especially if Ray had a class with him and had to keep going to class with him, you don’t want to be super rude and then you’re like, well I have to see him every day.
SARAH: Because clearly if this guy told everyone that they went on a date, I feel like if Ray had been more abrasive, he would have – On one hand, he could have been like, Ray’s mean, or whatever, but on the other hand, he also seemed to think they were in a committed relationship, so I don’t –
KAYLA: So I don’t know.
SARAH: I want to know how much experience that guy has with dating, because it’s like he clearly doesn’t understand how –
KAYLA: He definitely sounds like someone that is desperate for affection, and also maybe doesn’t have that much experience, because what decent person says things like that?
SARAH: Because even if you’re a fuckboy, you understand that first date does not equal committed relationship.
KAYLA: He kind of sounds like a wannabe fuckboy to me.
SARAH: Yeah. Like he’s trying to be cool –
KAYLA: But he is not.
SARAH: But he’s just – See, I feel like that’s the sort of thing where it’s just like, for someone who is ace but isn’t aro, and we’ve mentioned this before, we’re going to have someone on to talk about that, once we’re back at school, but it seems like it makes things so complicated and so difficult.
KAYLA: Not to say that one sexuality is harder than another, but the issues that you would face as someone that’s ace and not aro seem so difficult to me –
SARAH: Oh, same. Seems very difficult. I don’t feel – Sorry, go ahead.
KAYLA: No, you go ahead. (laughs) Mid-Western as fuck.
SARAH: True. I don’t feel bad for them, because I don’t think there’s any reason to feel bad about your sexuality, but I also feel a sense of, I’m sorry that you have to handle people’s reactions to that and you have to navigate this world which is really complicated, and you may meet someone who you really, really like and they may really like you, but if not having sex is a dealbreaker for them, even if you both really care about each other, it’s like that’s a dealbreaker, you know?
(30:00)
KAYLA: Right, because if you’re aro-ace, I feel like chances are you wouldn’t want to date, and I know there’s definitely aro-ace people who do want to –
SARAH: Can’t speak for all of them.
KAYLA: Right, but I think that’s a fair assumption to make. But if you are not aro, and you do want to date then it’s like, I feel like navigating the world as an ace person is already such a situation –
SARAH: It’s so complicated.
KAYLA: That to add on the aspect of dating is just like, what the fuck.
SARAH: Right, and I think it’s also even different from if you’re aro but you’re not ace, because hook up culture and having casual sex is a lot more, I would say it’s a lot simpler to navigate in this world because it’s more of like, people are okay with that.
KAYLA: Well, I don’t know if I would even say that, because we’re in college and so that’s really normal for us –
SARAH: That’s true,
KAYLA: But I don’t know, once you get out to the real world if – Because can you sustainably do that forever without people being like, oh you’re 30, what are you doing?
SARAH: Right, I was about to say once you get to 30, probably, is the cut off, people are going to be questioning it.
KAYLA: Why aren’t you in a relationship? Yeah, that’s valid.
SARAH: (sings) Why is the world like this?
KAYLA: That’s an excellent question.
SARAH: I guess do you have any comments in terms of how your experience in dating – I don’t know, I don’t really have a good question formulated, but as someone who has dated people –
KAYLA: I have done that.
SARAH: Do you have –
KAYLA: I mean, I’ve only gone on, I think two dates – So I started realizing I was demisexual while I was in a past relationship, and that was fine because he was like, cool, and also we had already been having sex so it’s not like it affected anything. TMI, I guess, I don’t know.
SARAH: (laughs)
KAYLA: But I know with my current boyfriend I had had – I met him on Tinder and I had demisexual in my bio, so he knew –
SARAH: But so did this guy in this story.
KAYLA: Right. And with him, I guess I never asked him – I knew he knew, but I never asked him about it and he didn’t ask me about it until maybe three dates in. So I don’t know.
SARAH: But you also, from what I understand, haven’t been on that many dates that haven’t ended in a relationship? That have led to a relationship?
KAYLA: Yeah, that’s true.
SARAH: So I think it’s a very different viewpoint than someone who has been on a lot of dates that were just dates, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah, that’s true. I’ve definitely been in situations where someone [was] just looking for a hookup-type relationship, and because I was demi, I was like, no, and that got in the way of things, I guess? And that was not a fun situation for me, so I can only imagine in a situation where you’re actually going on a date with someone and expecting it to be something more because you’re actually going on a date and then having that happen, that seems to me it would be an even amplified situation of that, which sounds painful.
SARAH: But also, I think it is worth saying that as much as it can be difficult if that’s your situation, it’s by no means impossible to find a relationship –
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: That you can stay in and that is a fulfilling relationship, and the person who you’re in a relationship [with] may be ace and they may not be ace, but it’s just –
KAYLA: Relationships with people – People that are ace have relationships, there are people with healthy, successful relationships that are ace.
SARAH: Yeah. I don’t know if I have that much more to say on the topic, but I think it’s a good introduction to the ways that ace umbrella sexualities differ in your experience a lot. If you think about people who are gay, I mean yes there are different experiences as to how they deal with their relationships and stuff, but the ace umbrella has so much diversity in terms of what is out there. And so there’s no standard ace experience, and that’s fine.
KAYLA: Because with this person, they are ace and sex repulsed, but you may have a completely different experience if someone is ace and sex positive. So that date could have gone – I mean, that guy was an asshole, so I don’t know that that date really could have gone –
SARAH: I hope that anyone who listens to this pod, if they run into a guy like that, or if they run into that guy specifically, don’t do it.
KAYLA: He might be in Grand Rapids, we don’t know.
BOTH: (laugh)
KAYLA: I don’t know his name because Ray was respectful enough to take his name out but I just think that there’s – Say that he wasn’t an asshole, depending on your sexuality, there’s just so many ways that things could go depending on what you’re comfortable with and what you identify as.
SARAH: And so for those of you listening also, me and Kayla’s experiences are not the only way, and so if you do fall under ace umbrella but you have a wildly different experience, fuck yeah.
KAYLA: I think that’s one of the reasons I wanted to read this, because also I did think that it was funny and wild, but also I think it’s good to get other people’s experiences, because we are just us and there are people with massively different experiences than we have.
SARAH: Indeed. Nice.
KAYLA: Woo.
SARAH: Anything else that you would like to say on the matter?
KAYLA: Not really. Thank you to Rachel for sending that in.
SARAH: For sending that our way.
KAYLA: I thought it was very entertaining.
SARAH: Yeah, and for letting us talk about it on the pod. What’s our poll?
KAYLA: Ooh, um –
SARAH: Oh, I got a poll. So if you were in this scenario and if you were Ray, at what point would you be like, I can’t do this anymore, I’m leaving. 1) –
KAYLA: I would – Okay.
SARAH: What?
KAYLA: I just don’t know what I would answer.
SARAH: Okay. So 1) would be – Hold on, I just have to make sure we have four correct, so there were 5 different parts to the [story], okay so the last one would be, when Ray did. The one prior to that would be when he asked to go to his place. The one prior to that would be ice-skating, the one prior to that would be at lunch.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: It’s like a Choose Your Own Adventure.
SARAH: Yeah, so 1) is going to be at lunch when he starts –
KAYLA: When he’s like, let’s get married.
SARAH: The next one is ice skating, or on the way to ice skating or whatever, when things started getting really –
KAYLA: Well that’s when he misgenders them and it’s like –
SARAH: Not good. “Angel”. The two genders are man and angel.
BOTH: (laugh)
SARAH: The next one is when he asks to go back to his place, and then the final option would be, I would have done the same thing that Ray did.
KAYLA: Yep.
SARAH: So yeah, let us know.
KAYLA: I honestly think I would probably have done the same thing Ray did, or have not gone to the apartment, because that is just – I just can’t, I don’t like confrontation. You know what I’m saying?
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: You know what I’m saying?
SARAH: Also, let’s not shame anyone for the decisions they did or would make here, because that’s a difficult situation to navigate through.
KAYLA: Yeah, like I said, I probably would have done the same thing as Ray. Dates are awkward and you don’t know how to get out of them. It’s, yeah.
SARAH: Yeah. Also, be realistic with what you would actually do, not when you would want to do it, but when you actually would.
KAYLA: Yeah, because I think we all would have liked to leave when he started misgendering them –
SARAH: I would have started –
I would have loved to leave when he started talking about marriage.
KAYLA: Well, yeah but –
SARAH: But when would you have actually pulled the plug?
KAYLA: Yep.
SARAH: Pulled the plug. Alright, cool. So that’s our poll, you can find that – Uh, wait, what’s your beef of the week?
KAYLA: Oh my God. Um –
SARAH: My beef of the week is that I’ve never been to Ireland.
KAYLA: Oh, okay.
SARAH: Yeah, I’d really like to go to Ireland. I’d also like to see more of Scotland, I’d like to go to go to everywhere in the British Isles.
KAYLA: Okay.
(40:00)
SARAH: Seems like a good time. Yeah, that’s all.
KAYLA: My beef of the week is that I naturally have olive skin so I’m darker because I’m Italian, and some people still have the audacity to get tanner than me in the summer, and it’s like, no. That’s my thing. (laughs)
SARAH: Oh my God, Kayla.
KAYLA: It’s my thing Sarah, I’m the tan one.
SARAH: God.
KAYLA: Anyway, that’s my beef of the week.
SARAH: I’m very freckly right now, it’s pretty exciting.
KAYLA: Well, yeah. It’s summer.
SARAH: Well, I’ve been outside. Anyway, you can find our poll, or if you want to tell us your beef of the week, on our Twitter @soundsfakepod.
KAYLA: Please do.
SARAH: We also have a Tumblr, soundsfakepod.tumblr.com and we also have an email, soundsfakepod@gmail.com. If you would like to send us a story or something interesting to our email, you are absolutely welcome to. We can’t guarantee that it’ll end up on the pod, and if you ask us not to, we will absolutely not put it on the pod, but if you want to, go for it.
KAYLA: Please do, I enjoy getting emails a lot.
SARAH: It’s a safe little space for you to tell us things.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: Again, that’s soundsfakepod@gmail.com. We also have a Patreon, you can find that at patreon.com/soundsfakepod. Everything is just /soundsfakepod.
KAYLA: That’s true.
SARAH: If you’d like to give us your money dollars, we will gladly accept them and then buy mics. For our $2 patrons we have Sara Jones and Keith McBlaine, for our $5 patrons we have Jennifer Smart, Asritha Vinnakota, Austin Le, Drew Finney and Perry Fiero.
Our $10 patrons are Emma Fink, you can find her on YouTube by looking up Emma T Fink, and Tristan Call who would like to promote the DeviantArt and Tumblr page @rationallyparanoid.
We also have a website.
KAYLA: It’s down below.
SARAH: It’s down below.
KAYLA: Click it to take our survey, please.
SARAH: Hell, yeah. So thank you for listening, and again thank you to Rachel for sending your story and giving us permission to talk about it. So thanks for listening, tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.
KAYLA: And until then, take good care of your cows.